Thu May 25, 2023, 07:47 PM
brooklynite (86,878 posts)
Supreme Court rules in favor of 94-year-old woman who got nothing when county took her condo
Source: Associated Press
WASHINGTON (AP) — A unanimous Supreme Court on Thursday gave a 94-year-old Minneapolis woman a new chance to recoup some money after the county kept the entire $40,000 when it sold her condominium over a small unpaid tax bill.
The justices ruled that Hennepin County, Minnesota violated the constitutional rights of the woman, Geraldine Tyler, by taking her property without paying “just compensation.” “The County had the power to sell Tyler’s home to recover the unpaid property taxes. But it could not use the toehold of the tax debt to confiscate more property than was due,” Chief Justice John Roberts wrote for the court. Tyler, who now lives in an apartment building for older people, owed $2,300 in unpaid taxes, plus interest and penalties totalling $15,000, when the county took title to the one-bedroom apartment in 2015. The county said she did nothing to hold onto her one-time residence. The apartment sold the next year. Read more: https://apnews.com/article/supreme-court-unpaid-taxes-d8a47701c2ff35436c7f96dad2e94f27
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26 replies, 2741 views
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Author | Time | Post |
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brooklynite | Thursday | OP |
BlueWaveNeverEnd | Thursday | #1 | |
Joinfortmill | Thursday | #2 | |
flying_wahini | Thursday | #3 | |
oldsoftie | Thursday | #4 | |
Hugh_Lebowski | Friday | #10 | |
yaesu | Thursday | #5 | |
SouthernDem4ever | Thursday | #6 | |
Polybius | Friday | #9 | |
yaesu | Friday | #11 | |
SouthernDem4ever | Friday | #17 | |
oldsoftie | Friday | #14 | |
Polybius | Friday | #22 | |
Justice | Friday | #21 | |
ripcord | Saturday | #24 | |
Polybius | Saturday | #25 | |
Deminpenn | 14 hrs ago | #26 | |
flvegan | Thursday | #7 | |
yaesu | Friday | #12 | |
Justice | Friday | #20 | |
ToxMarz | Thursday | #8 | |
FBaggins | Friday | #15 | |
sindri | Friday | #13 | |
Crepuscular | Friday | #16 | |
SouthernDem4ever | Friday | #18 | |
Hortensis | Friday | #19 | |
cannabis_flower | Friday | #23 |
Response to brooklynite (Original post)
Thu May 25, 2023, 07:53 PM
BlueWaveNeverEnd (4,621 posts)
1. good
Response to brooklynite (Original post)
Thu May 25, 2023, 08:13 PM
Joinfortmill (11,468 posts)
2. A good thing just happened.
Response to brooklynite (Original post)
Thu May 25, 2023, 08:24 PM
flying_wahini (5,268 posts)
3. Better late than never but this shit just chaps my ass bad.
Response to brooklynite (Original post)
Thu May 25, 2023, 09:10 PM
oldsoftie (10,958 posts)
4. A GREAT decision & unanimous. Other local govts should take note.
I cant STAND things like this.
Next up do cash seizure when there are no criminal charges. |
Response to oldsoftie (Reply #4)
Fri May 26, 2023, 02:02 AM
Hugh_Lebowski (31,934 posts)
10. +1000 (nt)
Response to brooklynite (Original post)
Thu May 25, 2023, 10:32 PM
yaesu (7,949 posts)
5. So, will this finally put an end to states stealing people's homes
In states like where I live you never truly own a home because you must pay the property tax extortion or else you get the boot.
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Response to yaesu (Reply #5)
Thu May 25, 2023, 10:43 PM
SouthernDem4ever (3,157 posts)
6. You'll still get the boot
but you might also get the difference left over when it is sold and the taxes are deducted.
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Response to SouthernDem4ever (Reply #6)
Fri May 26, 2023, 01:59 AM
Polybius (12,715 posts)
9. Imagine buying a TV and having to pay the tax every year until you sell it
Probably tax reaks unconstitutional, and may one day be struck down.
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Response to Polybius (Reply #9)
Fri May 26, 2023, 05:25 AM
yaesu (7,949 posts)
11. Lits hope, plus corporations get huge prop tax breaks and the increase the prop
Tax for us to make up for it.
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Response to yaesu (Reply #11)
Fri May 26, 2023, 09:20 AM
SouthernDem4ever (3,157 posts)
17. That has always been a problem - the corps hold communities hostage
They say, either no taxes or no jobs.
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Response to Polybius (Reply #9)
Fri May 26, 2023, 07:24 AM
oldsoftie (10,958 posts)
14. How do you propose cities & counties fund themselves without prop taxes?
We could use sales taxes, but then everyone whines about it being "regressive"
Local income taxes are too easy to avoid. There are NO states that dont have property taxes. |
Response to oldsoftie (Reply #14)
Fri May 26, 2023, 12:55 PM
Polybius (12,715 posts)
22. Not saying you're wrong
Just saying it might be unconstitutional.
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Response to Polybius (Reply #9)
Sat May 27, 2023, 11:04 AM
ripcord (3,956 posts)
24. So you don't want sewers or other local services property taxes provide?
Response to ripcord (Reply #24)
Sat May 27, 2023, 01:23 PM
Polybius (12,715 posts)
25. I'm just speaking of its constitutionality
There are other ways to get money.
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Response to SouthernDem4ever (Reply #6)
Mon May 29, 2023, 11:26 PM
Deminpenn (14,896 posts)
26. The penalties and interest were ridiculous
15,000-2,300 = 12,700 in penalties and interest.
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Response to brooklynite (Original post)
Thu May 25, 2023, 10:51 PM
flvegan (64,233 posts)
7. Proper finding, however, here's some frightening stuff, if true:
"Minnesota is among roughly a dozen states and the District of Columbia that allow local jurisdictions to keep the excess money, according to the Pacific Legal Foundation, a not-for-profit public interest law firm focused on property rights that represented Tyler at the Supreme Court.
The other states are: Alabama, Arizona, Colorado, Illinois, Maine, Massachusetts, Nebraska, New Jersey, New York, Oregon and South Dakota, the group said." Unjust enrichment, anyone? My state, land of the stupid, at least gets this right (tax certificates and tax deeds sales). Do better. |
Response to flvegan (Reply #7)
Fri May 26, 2023, 05:27 AM
yaesu (7,949 posts)
12. Michigan also keeps all the loot. Nt
Response to flvegan (Reply #7)
Fri May 26, 2023, 11:25 AM
Justice (7,080 posts)
20. This is correct. And many cities/towns sell tax liens to private for-profit investors
The for-profit companies go after delinquent taxpayers and recover lost revenue.
Investors can collect big % interest from homeowners whose titles were sold off. If those property owners fail to pay back the debt, investors can foreclose. The liens might be for property taxes but can also be for unpaid water or sewer bills (much smaller amounts). The for profit companies buying the tax liens do it because they are making money. |
Response to brooklynite (Original post)
Thu May 25, 2023, 11:40 PM
ToxMarz (2,083 posts)
8. It would also be nice if they did something about how
$2,300 in unpaid taxes, plus interest and penalties becomes a $15,000 bill.
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Response to ToxMarz (Reply #8)
Fri May 26, 2023, 07:29 AM
FBaggins (25,902 posts)
15. I'm not as concerned about that
It seems excessive. But part of that is because the home's value was so low.
Counties incur significant expense in the process of foreclosing on and auctioning off these properties. The delinquent taxpayer should bear those expenses - as well as a proportional sharing of the costs of running the department (or subcontracting it out). The great part of this ruling isn't just that Geraldine Tyler (and others like her) will get what was stolen from them... it's that the counties will lose the incentive to do this in the first place (possibly encouraging them to help struggling homeowners stay in their homes). I suspect that the ruling will cause a bunch of counties to start getting claims for refunds of what was stolen. I wonder whether there will be a scorecard of the worst offenders. |
Response to brooklynite (Original post)
Fri May 26, 2023, 07:18 AM
sindri (29 posts)
13. the county is not making money on these things
It still costs taxpayers more to demolish, repair, pay for staff, etc. than they take for these situations. If they can't do this now, they will need to find a way to cover costs of taking care of neglected properties like this. She could have sold but she didn't. Other situations often require expensive demolition and removal of debris and the proceeds for selling properties cover the cost.
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Response to brooklynite (Original post)
Fri May 26, 2023, 09:04 AM
Crepuscular (1,048 posts)
16. ...
This was the right decision and this precedent may protect others in the future but Ms. Tyler won't benefit from it, in all likelihood.
In addition to the $15,000 that she owed for back taxes, it appears that she also had a $49,000 mortgage and owed $12,000 in unpaid HOA fees, which easily exceeded the market value of her property. That is why Hennipin County argued that she effectively abandoned the property when she walked away from it and stopped paying those outstanding debts. I suspect that most of the time that a property is taken over for back taxes, the owner has little or no equity in the property, which is why they don't simply sell it, pay off their debts and keep any equity. It's a major pain for the government to have to take over an abandoned property and there is significant expense involved. In this case, the mortgage holder decided to write off the mortgage instead of foreclosing, since they were unlikely to recoup enough of their investment to make it worth their while, so it went to the County for back taxes. While I think it's a good thing that the owner would get any equity over and above what the County is able to sell the property for, less the value of any costs incurred by the County to do so, I don't know that it's the Counties job to make any other lien holders whole. |
Response to Crepuscular (Reply #16)
Fri May 26, 2023, 09:25 AM
SouthernDem4ever (3,157 posts)
18. True - especially if there were leans on the property
The mortgage holder won't let you sell it. Counties should be able to do an accounting of their costs associated with prep and selling of the property and recover that.
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Response to Crepuscular (Reply #16)
Fri May 26, 2023, 09:39 AM
Hortensis (56,720 posts)
19. Thanks for a more complete and very common picture. nt
Response to brooklynite (Original post)
Fri May 26, 2023, 02:47 PM
cannabis_flower (3,695 posts)
23. I hope the lawyer
Was Pro Bono
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