Lebanese Army Storms Islamist Mosque as Syria Crisis Spreads

[Comrade Grumpy]

Source: Reuters

Reuters) - Lebanese soldiers stormed a complex holding gunmen loyal to a radical Islamist cleric in the city of Sidon on Monday and arrested dozens of his supporters, security sources said, in a second day of clashes fuelled by neighboring Syria's civil war. The fighting is the deadliest outbreak in Lebanon since Syria's two-year conflict began.

The army said 12 soldiers were killed in the southern Mediterranean port city, while security sources gave a higher army toll of 18 dead and 128 wounded. A medic told Reuters that 22 bodies had been pulled from the mosque complex but he expected the final death count to be higher. He said 94 wounded had been treated by the Red Cross.

The violence has strained fragile sectarian relations across Lebanon and residents fear that Syria-related clashes could drag their country back into civil war. Lebanon is still struggling to heal the wounds of 15 years of war between 1975 and 1990. Fighting spread to a second city on Monday, with Sunni fighters in the northern city of Tripoli opening fire on the military and blocking roads with cement blocks and burning tires. By nightfall, clashes there had injured two soldiers and three gunmen.

Hardline Sunni cleric Sheikh Ahmed al-Assir, who has accused the army of backing the interests of the Shi'ite Muslim group Hezbollah, was still at large after the battle in Sidon. The army is trying to kill or capture him, accusing him of killing soldiers "in cold blood" on Sunday.

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Read more: http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/06/24/us-syria-crisis-lebanon-idUSBRE95N0VR20130624

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Mr. al-Assir has called for jihad in Syria and appears to be trying to re-ignite the Lebanese civil war, which ravaged the country between 1975 and 1990, an eerie forerunner of what's happening in Syria now.

[geek tragedy]

1. Heh, the Lebanese army dispatched to do Hezbollah's dirty work for them, nt

[Comrade Grumpy]

2. Sorry. The jihadis starting this by ambushing an army checkpoint.

Mr. al-Assir is calling for jihad in Syria and trying to reignite the civil war in Lebanon. I think he will soon earn the fate he so richly deserves.

[Comrade Grumpy]

3. Meanwhile, his soul brothers in Baghdad have killed another 40 people.

There's a thread about it Bosonic posted a few minutes ago.

[geek tragedy]

4. Not shedding any tears for this guy or his followers.

But, not a coincidence that Hezbollah gets to stir shit up on the Syrian side of the border, and then expect Christian and Sunnis in the armed forces to clean up the mess.

Lebanon's in a weird situation, no civil war, but not really a functional state either.

[Comrade Grumpy]

5. I hear you, but I would say that Hezbollah has an organic presence on the Syrian border.

I mean Qusayr, where they intervened on Assad's side, is only about 10 miles from the border, in an area dotted with Shiite villages and just a rocket-launch away from the Bekaa Valley. Those Syria Shiite villagers are from the same clans as those Lebanese Shiite villagers. On the ground there, the border is just an invisible line.

That's a bit different from the Chechens, Tunisians, Qataris--not to mention Belgians, Brits, and Americans--and other jihadi riff-raff traveling hundreds or thousands of miles to cut the heads of apostates.

[geek tragedy]

6. But all of Lebanon is going to have live right across the border from Sunni villagers and clans

for the rest of our natural lives.

It seems unwise for Lebanon's entire future to be wagered on the success of Shiites in Syria.

Sure Hezbollah and Assad combined can kick the crap out of the ragtag group of legit rebels and head choppers, but long term it's a numbers game. And, the US and Europe are more than happy to provide a little treasure so that others' blood can be spilled to drag it out a long time, draining Iran and Hezbollah's resources.

[Comrade Grumpy]

9. I suspect that what you postulate is indeed the case.

Washington, London, and Paris want to bleed Iran and Hezbollah for geostrategic reasons.

If that is indeed the case, then all this talk about human rights and democracy in Syria is little more than stunning exercise in imperial cynicism and hypocrisy. Color me shocked.

[geek tragedy]

11. What's sad is that, after the misadventures of Bush, this seems like a relief.

"At least we're not going to get bogged down in a quagmire. Too bad about those 90,000 dead Syrians though."

[John2]

8. I don't think

you want Hezbullah to take care of these extremists do you? They already kick their butts once? Do you really think it would be an even match?

[Comrade Grumpy]

10. ?????

I don't know what you're trying to say.

[John2]

12. I'm trying to

say Hezbullah is even more better equipped than the Lebanese Army. I'm speaking as a person that served in the military for over a Decade. I went to military leadership schools. This is what I'm trying to say to you from a military perspective. You can either accept my expertise or not.

First of all, you need to look at the information or intelligence reports from both sides. I paid very close attention to what the opposition was claiming happening on the battlefield in their confrontation with Hezbullah in Qusair. They were claiming dozens of Hezbullah fighters were getting killed in that battle, as if they were causing heavy casualties on Hezbullah.

One thing the opposition kept secret was their own casualties. Sure they killed dozens of Hezbullah fighters, but Hezbullah killed thousands, not hundreds, but thousands. The confrontations took place in urban areas, house to house. This is the same guerrilla type force that took on Israel remember.

What they sent to Syria was only a few thousand fighters out of an estimated 75,000. Those are some of the reports Hezbullah is up to now from several sources and one of them was Israel. They also are better armed than the Lebanese Army. If the Lebanese Army wanted to disarm Hezbullah, they would have a problem doing so. I'm talking from a military perspective.

Most of these fighters, were trained by Special Forces in Iran, through Iran's Revolutionary Guard. I also looked at the typical profile of some of their fighters and you would be surprised, what some of them do in civilian occupations. Some are doctors and lawyers, which suggests they have a high IQ. It also suggests they are not your typical religious extremists. One gave an interview to a journalist, and claimed that he joined Hezbullah just to resist the United States and Israel. It was for oppression and human rights of Arabs. It had nothing to do with religion. He claimed it was a cause that he would die for.

So terrorism from religious extremists, or Fatwas by fanatical clerics are not going to deter these people from fighting for a cause. It would be just like me fighting on the battlefield for America. They are willing to die for it. They laid out what obstacles they have to do to defeat the Terrorists in Qusair. They said it was slow and Guerrilla Warfare. The Terrorists had mined the Towns. They also had dug tunnels on the Lebanese border and Syrian border, to sneak weapons across the Border. These fighters claimed they killed hundreds of Terrorists in those tunnels. I believe them because that is what I was trained to do. The information was very detailed. It told me these guys knew what they were doing and they were good at it. Now I know why Israel see them as a threat. Compared to Hezbullah, the rebels are amateurs.

[Comrade Grumpy]

14. Tend to agree. I don't underestimate Hezbollah, either.

[azurnoir]

7. Good it's time for the Lebanese army to do something

Sheikh Ahmed al-Assir is an extremist who needs to be stopped

[jessie04]

13. I was keeping a scorecard

but I lost tract of who is on which side.

[Comrade Grumpy]

15. It only matters if you care about what's going on there.

[kitt6]

16. Why can't thieves be

happy with one huge theft? (historically) Because they got away with it!