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Tue Dec 23, 2014, 02:40 AM

 

Police Unions 'Standing Down' After Controversial Comments In Wake Of NYPD Shooting

Source: Huffington Post

During a press conference Monday afternoon, NYPD Commissioner Bill Bratton said the unions had agreed to stop putting out statements out of respect for Liu's and Ramos' families. De Blasio also called for a temporary halt to the protests to allow the families to mourn.

"I've had the opportunity today to talk with the leadership of all five of our police unions, in line with what the mayor has referenced, asking that demonstrations and other forms of protests be put on hold until after the Christmas holidays and after the funerals," said Bratton. "In discussion with the five presidents of our various unions, they are standing down in respect for the fallen members until after the funerals, and then we can continue the dialogue that had begun about issues and differences that exist."

Read more: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/12/22/ny-police-unions_n_6368756.html




It appears that Police Commissioner Bratton has negotiated what can best be described as a "ceasefire" between the police unions and mayor and other prominent Democrats. Well done, Commissioner. If he wasn't able to bridge the gap, I don't know of anyone else who had even remotely comparable levels of respect and trust.

The terms appear to be simple: no major anti-police protests or statements in return for radio silence from the unions, at least until after the officers' funerals and Christmas.

If the truce holds for at least a few days, tempers should hopefully be able to calm. However, even the smallest spark can start an inferno. I sincerely hope and pray that nothing happens in the coming days (or ever) - no victims of police violence and no one attacking the police.

Amen!

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Reply Police Unions 'Standing Down' After Controversial Comments In Wake Of NYPD Shooting (Original post)
branford Dec 2014 OP
StevePaulson Dec 2014 #1
branford Dec 2014 #2
StevePaulson Dec 2014 #6
branford Dec 2014 #10
StevePaulson Dec 2014 #18
riversedge Dec 2014 #4
99th_Monkey Dec 2014 #3
StevePaulson Dec 2014 #5
Live and Learn Dec 2014 #13
Euphoria Dec 2014 #15
99th_Monkey Dec 2014 #20
KingCharlemagne Dec 2014 #7
branford Dec 2014 #11
StevePaulson Dec 2014 #8
Live and Learn Dec 2014 #14
lib87 Dec 2014 #9
branford Dec 2014 #12
BronxBoy Dec 2014 #19
Taitertots Dec 2014 #16
SCVDem Dec 2014 #17

Response to branford (Original post)

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 02:52 AM

1. One Thing That Might Help

Would be an indictment of Choke Cop.

Everything else is just pissing in the wind.

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Response to StevePaulson (Reply #1)

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 03:06 AM

2. There's virtually no chance of a state indictment,

 

and although the DOJ is still "investigating," the probability of a criminal civil rights charge are very small given the very high standards and burdens that must be met by the government.

Even with an indictment, any state trial would be in Staten Island (a federal trial would be in Brooklyn). If they couldn't secure an indictment in the county, an actual conviction would appear extremely remote, at best.

There's a reason why deBlasio, Cuomo and Holder have not spoken about charges after the grand jury failed to indict, other that general an vague pronouncements about "investigations" and "reforms."

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Response to branford (Reply #2)

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 03:19 AM

6. Choking Someone

Is against the law, and is not allowed by police.

Not all that hard to prosecute.

Especially when the now dead person was pleading "I can't breathe"
while being choked to f-ing death.

Dude says "I can't breathe" over and over. Did choke cop stop choking
him? Hell no.

Choke cop is f-ing a murderer.

Let a jury decide.

Oh, and I want a real prosecutor, not a joke jerk off.

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Response to StevePaulson (Reply #6)

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 03:56 AM

10. A few points, although I personally would support a state trial.

 

1. A choke hold is not against the law. It is against NYPD procedure. It is not against the law to not follow NYPD procedure, although the officer could be subject to internal disciple, including termination.

2. The officer actually claims that his maneuver was not actually the prohibited choke hold. As I'm not an expert in police tactics, I have no idea about the veracity of such a position.

3. A suspect stating "I can't breathe" is not necessarily dispositive. In addition to the arguments that his statements proved that he could breathe (which I personally do not credit, although I jury might easily disagree), suspects often make such claims in order to attempt escape or improve otherwise acceptable police treatment. I used to go on police ride alongs all the time. If I had a dime whenever someone claimed brutality or something similar without any basis in fact, I would be a rich man. Simply, at trial, Garner's statement would not be as powerful or convincing as you may believe. Defense attorneys are well equipped and prepared to deal with such issues.

4. Murder requires specific intent. I cannot see how any prosecutor could support such a charge. A more appropriate charge would be manslaughter or negligent homicide. The fact that Garner's death could be partially attributed to his poor health makes any charging decision and trial all the more difficult for the prosecution.

5. Politically or legally, I do not know how the case can be brought before another state grand jury, and neither the NY AG or governor has made any such suggestion.

6. A federal criminal civil rights charge must meet a higher burden than a state case. It is not simply a second bite at the apple. Like murder, it requires specific intent to violate Garner's civil rights, and is why there are so few federal prosecutions. I would also note that at the time of the incident, among the many officers involved, the officer in charge was actually a black female sergeant. I have no idea how any federal prosecutor could show racial animus unless there is a currently unrevealed, yet very large revealed trove, of blatantly and easily demonstrated racist conduct by the choking officer.

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Response to branford (Reply #10)

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 11:21 AM

18. Reply

1. Choking someone is against the law.....

2. I don't care what murderer/cop claims. His - Choke - Killed - Eric - Garner

3. I can see brutality. No need for "claim".

4. Choking someone who is saying "I can't breathe" sounds like intent to choke/kill.

5. They are politicians. Their "right and wrong" is based on their campaign, not right or wrong.

6. Ask Ken Starr what a Federal Prosecutor can do......

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Response to StevePaulson (Reply #1)

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 03:11 AM

4. #1

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Response to branford (Original post)

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 03:08 AM

3. Does that mean no more unarmed young black men will be getting murdered by cops?

 

Last edited Tue Dec 23, 2014, 05:13 AM - Edit history (1)

That would be standing down IMHO.

That would be a start.

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Response to branford (Original post)

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 03:12 AM

5. Police Union = How Many?

Ask the unions how many unarmed people a cop would have to
murder/shoot/choke before the union would support prosecuting them?

The mayor was elected to clean up the asshole New York cops
if I remember correctly. Stop and frisk minorities. Like we all forgot that.
Not like they were frisking white cokeheads dressed in suits scoring in
broad daylight. Minorities are just easier to push around. Less likely to have
good lawyers. Gotta fill them jails somehow right? Not like you are going
down to Wall Street and arresting real criminals stealing billions from millions.

If the cops/unions asked for accountability for their sucky violent friends, instead
of asking for all cops to get away with every murder every time, those
2 dead cops would still be alive, and Michael Brown, and Eric Gardner's
murderers would be facing a jury.

Being a good cop can't be easy. Especially if it means asking for justice
for bad cops actions.

And I am not anti-police. I am anti-murder. Pro justice.

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Response to StevePaulson (Reply #5)

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 04:48 AM

13. +1 nt

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Response to StevePaulson (Reply #5)

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 05:00 AM

15. +2 nt

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Response to StevePaulson (Reply #5)

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 03:52 PM

20. An awesome OP.. thank you.

 

You have helped me to think a little clearer in this shit-storm of disinformation and misinformation flying around.

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Response to branford (Original post)

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 03:22 AM

7. I don't know where you're getting 'no major anti-police protests' out of the article to

 

which you link. I saw nothing inside it to suggest that there will be no further anti-police protests until after Christmas. To my reading, it appears the police unions unconditionally surrendered.

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Response to KingCharlemagne (Reply #7)

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 04:14 AM

11. DeBlasio had already called for a protest moratorium until, at a minimum, after the funerals,

 

and has been praising the police and Commissioner Bratton like conquering heroes all of Monday. Would you argue that deBlasio first unconditionally surrendered?

It's obvious that this deal was worked out well before the announcement, and all sides were just trying to ensure that quiet will really be met with quiet. No one wanted to get ahead of their constituents or allies.

Thus far, not only has the city been quite, there have even been a number of peaceful and relatively quiet pro-police and pro-unity demonstrations. We have similarly not heard anything this evening from the police unions.

If any militants try to cause trouble with anything remotely like the call for dead cops played repeatedly by the news, or by blocking traffic and similar conduct, I would imagine that the mayor and most Democrats will not be as passive or quiet as before. Similarly, if any unions leader or allies mouth-off, they will not benefit from the protection of Republican allies, or far worse, be explicitly criticized by Commissioner Bratton, who maintains the trust and respect of the rank and file.

If you think the police unions unconditionally surrendered, then by all means, encourage some protesters to block a bridge. Just don't say you weren't warned.

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Response to branford (Original post)

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 03:30 AM

8. Only A Matter Of Time

Before the people being murdered on a daily basis start shooting back.

Not one single media blow hard mentioned blowback.

Why do they even have news?

There is a lot of black/poor people that are getting sick
of being pushed around, abused, frisked, or shot
for that matter.

Times are a changin' this time.

Our laws are obviously only enforced when it is poor people
doing the crimes.

When it is a banker, or a person ordering torture, or someone lying
about assets, or committing "white collar" crimes, they are never
looked at. We have laws against Americans bribing foreign officials
and they are not enforced at all.

Only poor, defenseless people go to jail. The rest get away.

We live in a banana republic, where politicians can be bought, and
legally bribed, and basically placed in office, and the wealthy can
not be prosecuted for anything, ever. It is up to the poor and the
minorities to suck it up and just do their time.

This sick game of privilege is over folks. Homey ain't gonna play that game
no more.

The war has started.

Eric Garner was like Pearl Harbor. After Trayvon's killer was not going to be
prosecuted except after the ruckus, and Darren Wilson was protected by
a fake prosecutor who broke many laws influencing a confused grand
jury, the bombs just dropped.

Now the cops can start arresting rich people too, or it will continue to get
worse by the day.

Anyone with half a brain knows half the bank executives got away with crimes
and that ain't goin' away.

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Response to StevePaulson (Reply #8)

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 04:49 AM

14. +1 nt

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Response to branford (Original post)

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 03:37 AM

9. Lip Service

I'm not falling for the nypd union's 'goodwill'. This 'goodwill' was nowhere to be found until today when it benefited them directly.

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Response to lib87 (Reply #9)

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 04:16 AM

12. Quiet benefits both the mayor and the union (and the City).

 

Everyone is acting in their own self-interest, and that's a good thing.

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Response to branford (Reply #12)

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 01:56 PM

19. I actually agree with you....

a couple of days of quiet hurts no one and will allow for some calm. And asking for such doesn't rise to the level of abridging free speech in my opinion.

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Response to branford (Original post)

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 08:39 AM

16. Are they going to stop abusing innocent people until after Christmas?

 

Why should we stop protesting over something that has no connection to our protests?

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Response to branford (Original post)

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 10:19 AM

17. Little wonder unions have lost public support

 

Every time a union makes some obscene demand be it the police or a sex/DV NFL offender, they hurt us all.

Who in their right mind excuses inexcusable behavior?

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