Nighttime shop queues banned in three Venezuela states amid shortages

[Bacchus4.0]

Source: Reuters

CARACAS (Reuters) - Governors in three Venezuelan states have banned nighttime queuing as huge lines continue to snake around shops across the scarcity-plagued OPEC nation.

Shortages of basic products from milk to toilet paper have worsened since a lull in distribution over the Christmas holidays, prompting many Venezuelans to wait from the early hours on pavements - or in hammocks - before shops open.

The ubiquitous lines and frequent jostling for places when doors open are an embarrassment and irritation to many Venezuelans across the political spectrum.

There have also been scattered protests and arrests.



Read more: http://news.yahoo.com/nighttime-shop-queues-banned-three-venezuela-states-amid-134143051.html;_ylt=AwrBEiEj1bZUGmUAcFHQtDMD

---

#t=12

grocery shopping

[louis-t]

1. I assume "many" Venezuelans means "rich".

Jeez, how long before they just start shooting people for standing in line? "Sorry if you're starving. not our fault. Why don't you eat cake?" I will never complain about a store being out of something again.

[Bacchus4.0]

2. Professional line stander is a new job opportunity in Venezuela. A capitalist idea thanks

to Venezuela's brand of socialism. Spanish article on this but essentially people will be paid overnight or for however long to wait in line for supermarkets to open and do the shopping for clients. http://www.eluniverso.com/noticias/2015/01/13/nota/4433446/profesionales-fila-nuevo-oficio-venezuela


Hunger Games

[louis-t]

3. Wow, wasn't there a Seinfeld episode about that?

I don't know why I went there.

[EX500rider]

5. I assume "many" Venezuelans means "poor".

Why would the rich have to stand in line? They pay someone else to shop for them.
The irritated ones are the ones who actually have to stand in long lines to get basic necessities.

[louis-t]

6. I read it that people were embarrassed by seeing people standing in line.

I'll read it again.

[christx30]

4. The question I have is

why, if Maduro is such a populist, and seeing how his policies are doing, why won't he change his policies to make things better for his people? Currency controls prevent stores from buying the products they need to sell to the people there. The controls lead to a lot of corruption, and a lot of people getting rich at the expense of the Venezuelan people. Why can't he just let go of a little of the control he has over the economy. I don't see how things could get much worse.

[Bacchus4.0]

8. A few thoughts on that

1. The deceased leader Chavez is revered by the chavista ruling party much like a cult. Government policies that do not adhere to "what would Hugo do" are not accepted by the chavista rank and file.

2. The ones getting rich are the chavistas in leadership as they have access to dollars. Imagine being able to buy dollars at the offical rate of 6 bolivars to one dollar go to the black market and sell those dollars you just bought at 6 Bs for 120 Bs. Then repeat.

3. I assume they do not want to float the currency because it will immediately become 10 times as worthless. Wages wouldn't increase along with the currency devaluation so it wouldn't help the consumer in the short term. It would make the the things that are in constant shortage like diapers, chicken, flour, toilet paper more expensive since the government subsidizes those.

4. Just when you think it can't get much worse, it does.


I am sure a Venezuelan expert here in DU could give you a better explanation, and I'm sure clueless chavistas will say its the fault of the US.

[christx30]

31. But what is going on is CLEARLY not working.

Even in the worst days of the Great Resession, you could still go into a grocery store, and buy whatever you wanted to. No soldiers were organizing lines. If you needed diapers at 3 in the morning, it was just a drive out to the nearest Walmart.
Could that happen in Venezuela? More than likely not.

And as for number 2, there are people in the US that are doing that to make money.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/110820945
Exactly as you outlined. No one in Venezuela has any incentive to end the corruption. Too many thumbs in the pie. And the Venezuelan people will suffer for it. And it's only getting worse. Until Maduro gets a reason to improve things, they won't improve.

[joshcryer]

45. It's an unfortunate type of cronyism.

Basically you don't ruffle the feathers because you get maligned quickly. Mind you, this type of thing is by no means unique to Venezuela, it happens everywhere. Go to any small town where everyone knows one another and call for reforms in some way or another. You'd be ostracized very quickly. It becomes more apparent here, where say, the police turned their back on the mayor, etc.

Maduro could change things, could try to do something, especially if he was granted sweeping powers by the legislator. Doing that could ruffle a lot of feathers, though and there are other competing factions in the government.

Cuba is a good example of a government recognizing that some things aren't working which is why they've privatized some businesses.

[Ykcutnek]

7. What a clusterfuck.

How anyone can point to Venezuela as an example of how to run a nation is beyond me.

[Bacchus4.0]

9. chavistas here still do n/t

[LiberalLovinLug]

13. Why don't you ask Obama?

He has taken over the relentless US covert attacks on their economy started under Bush. Much to perhaps the surprise of the politically illiterate, Venezuela is not a pure socialist country. No country could ever survive well anymore that way because of the whole global capitalist infrastructure and concentration of wealth in vital sectors. Venezuela is a mixed economy. So outside enemies like the multinational corporatists that tell Obama what to do, can wreak havoc on the areas in the economy that are still serviced by capitalist overlords. All in an attempt to create unrest and eventual return to corporate rule with a pro-US corporate leader.

A lot of DUers fooled into actually thinking this is all the fault of one man or his predecessor.

Here's a good article from another DU post by Judi Lynn

http://www.democraticunderground.com/110836262

2014 was also a year here in Venezuela that was scarred by actions of the political opposition, funded by Washington and supported by the Western media. Bereft of support by the majority of Venezuelans and unable to gain power through a peaceful electoral process, the opposition resorted to: sabotage of the infrastructure (e.g. attacks on the electrical grid); hoarding and dumping food and daily household products to keep them off the retail markets; manipulating food distribution to create the appearance of “shortages;’ smuggling subsidized products across the border into Colombia for huge profits; attacks on the economy with speculation and an illegal black-market dollar system, driving up a manipulated rate of inflation with spiraling prices in retail markets

[Throd]

14. I knew somebody would see the bat signal.

[LiberalLovinLug]

16. You're right, I saw the moonbat signal

of those who can't believe that the pure goody two shoes international corporate conglomerates could have anything to do with Venezuela's troubles. Its all because of that eeeeeeevil Socialism



http://axisoflogic.com/artman/publish/Article_69015.shtml

The Herrera CA warehouse where tons of illegally hoarded food and personal hygiene products were discovered by the Venezuelan government on Monday of this week. Large corporations like this hide products of basic needs to create the illusion that there are shortages in Venezuela as a means of destabilization.

The company busted yesterday for hoarding in Zulia is called Herrera CA. The holding company is in Barbados, Diamante Trading Investments Ltd, and it has shareholdings in the British Virgin Islands. The main representative here in Venezuela is Peggy Carolina Ordaz Quijada, 39, who is a leading member of the fascist political party Voluntad Popular in the state of Anzoátegui, Herrera CA has its headquarters in Maracaibo and subsidiaries in 8 western states of Venezuela and is the main food and person hygiene distributor in this region where 8.5 million people depend on it for basic supplies.

Herera has exclusive distribution rights in these western states for Kellogg, Nestlé, General Mills for foodstuffs and for Pfizer and Procter & Gamble for person hygiene products.

[Bacchus4.0]

18. Wow, seeing merchandise in a warehouse is like seeing food in a supermarket n/t

[LiberalLovinLug]

23. LOL

Is that supposed to be sarcastic?

You do understand the difference between a private corporation's warehouse full of packaged goods, sealed and guarded, where no retail sales are allowed....and a public supermarket.

Or maybe you don't.

[Bacchus4.0]

24. Here is a supermarket with items on the shelves like your warehouse

Look at what the people are fighting over though. People don't want to live on processed foods, sweets, and softdrinks.

[LiberalLovinLug]

27. So....you agree now?

I don't speak Spanish. In the Google translation of the description of the video says:

A user of the social network Facebook public this video of the arrival of the milk powder in a recognized venezuelan supermarket.

I just posted a picture of baby formula being hoarded in a sealed warehouse (once again fyi a private warehouse is not a supermarket). The fact that these parents are fighting for milk powder together with the picture of that hoarded formula in that warehouse should at the very least raise some questions in your mind. But as they say, you can lead a horse to milk formula....

I can't argue here in circles all day. I have other things to do.

[Bacchus4.0]

28. here is a pic of powered milk stored in a warehouse. What you would call hoarding

I can't explain it any easier.

[Throd]

20. It's more likely incompetence and corruption rather than some nefarious plot.

[gladium et scutum]

34. Agree

Never ascribe to malice that can be adequately explained by incompetence. (Napoleon)

[EX500rider]

39. ".....who is a leading member of the fascist political party Voluntad Popular"

Lol. great source there....really, they are a "fascist" party?

Popular Will (Spanish: Voluntad Popular, VP) is a centre-left political party in Venezuela.
The party was formed in reaction to alleged infringements of individual freedom and human rights on the part of the socialist government of the late Venezuelan President Hugo Chávez and his successor, Nicolas Maduro. The party brings together Venezuelans of various backgrounds who consider “chavismo” oppressive and authoritarian. Popular Will identifies itself as “a pluralist and democratic movement” that is committed to “progress,” which it defines as the realization of “the social, economic, political, and human rights of every Venezuelan.”

The party’s “fundamental pillars” are progress, democracy, and social action. In December 2014, the party was admitted into the Socialist International.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Popular_Will

And as to "hoarding", when the government enacts asinine price controls that coupled with currency controls makes you sell products under cost, yes lots of stuff will end up warehoused instead....or run across the border where you can sell for a profit.

[Tarheel_Dem]

51. +1. Excellent rebuttal!

[Amishman]

53. my guess is these were just unsold imports waiting for a buyer

Think about this a little.

The article you linked implies that these are mostly imported western goods. Since they came in from US and other markets, the importer payed for them with dollars or another stable currency. These goods would only leave warehouse once they are purchased. The importer will either want the buyer to pay in hard (non-bolivar) currency, or they will set the price according to the real exchange rate if they accept bolivars. Because of the weakness of the bolivar and currency controls preventing free exchange, it stands to reason that no one can afford to buy these imported goods.

Not hording, just basic economics.

[Bacchus4.0]

15. Saw that, all Venezuelas' problems are someone else's fault n/t

[LiberalLovinLug]

17. Of course not "all". That's a strawman

But enough to cause hardship and destabilization? Why is that so difficult to believe?

[Bacchus4.0]

19. So, if it weren't for the shortages, inflation, 2nd highest murder rate in the world, oil at $50

corruption, lack of domestic production, lack of diverse economic sector, ridiculous currency exchange system, and housing shortage, Venezuela would be a great example of a socialist country? Is that pretty much it strawman?

[LiberalLovinLug]

21. Many countries have those same problems

Not to mention all of them can be indirect results from those actions of those multinationals and the .1%, which are proven. What do think is meant by the word "destabilization"? And the price of oil has dropped...everywhere. And there is a credible speculation that the Saudi's and Americans colluded together to increase production, and drop prices to damage the oil revenues of Russia and Venezuela.

But keep deluding yourself though into thinking there is no power or influence with big money on an international scale if that makes the world simpler for you.

[Bacchus4.0]

22. No, many countries do not have the severity of those problems fortunately.

The horror!!! The US is producing oil to the detriment of Venezuela and Russia. Lets change our energy policy so that it benefits Russia and Venezuela, and not to our own benefit. Great idea!

Keep deluding yourself that the Venezuelan model would work if it weren't for the US.

shopping in Ven. Note the store has alot of products on the shelves (like your warehouse) but apparently not the ones people want or need.

[LiberalLovinLug]

25. Now your just not making any sense at all

You said oil prices were high. I told you they weren't and give you a reason, and you create yet another straw man to argue that I think its a "horror" and that the US should do things that are not to their benefit.

And what does "deluding yourself that the Venezuelan model would work if it weren't for the US" even mean? I can only surmise you believe that all the other mixed socialist countries like Sweden etc..would also go down the drain if it wasn't for the good ole US of A.

and uh....yes "not the ones people want or need" is right. Congratulations you got something correct. Once again this supermarket is not "like your warehouse", which is actually full of those products people DO need:



21,348 pounds (10.8 tons) of infant formula destined for Venezuela's mothers and babies were hoarded and kept off the shelves of retail markets.

[Bacchus4.0]

26. wtf!!! I didn't say they were high. They are low, thats a problem for Maduro

Venezuela needs oil to be at $100/barrel. What they really need is a diverse economy to ween themselves from oil. But that ain't gonna happen. They've never effectively diversified their economy since oil became a hot commodity.

Do you know what the purpose of a warehouse is? Just wondering. 21,000 pounds is about 10,000 cans I calculate for a population of about 30 million. I am guessing Ven has baby population of at least 3 million. Its a drop in the bucket.

This is simply a show put on by the government. "Hey look at all these products in the warehouse!" Which of course is exactly the place you would expect them to be.

[LiberalLovinLug]

29. fine fine

Yes I misinterpreted the high instead of low. mistake. But I explained one reason why the moneyed ruling elite would want that.

And if you can't even entertain the concept that the world's corporate elite would ever stoop to conspiring to ruin a self proclaimed socialist government, that nationalizes industries etc...then you are living in a delusion. Must be nice to live in a world of rainbows and unicorns.

I'm out a here. No point in arguing with a true believer.

[Bacchus4.0]

30. Are the world's elite conspiring to ruin Sweden? later n/t

[Tarheel_Dem]

32. It's Obama's fault? Really? And WTF do you mean by "mixed economy"?

Venezuelan president to meet Putin as oil-dependent economies sink

Moody's Investors Service said on Tuesday there was a high risk Venezuela would default on its debt.

Russia depends for half its budget revenue on energy, while Venezuela depends on oil for 96 percent of its hard currency revenue, leaving its economy at the mercy of a market that has seen prices drop 60 percent since June to under $46 a barrel.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/01/14/us-russia-crisis-oil-venezuela-idUSKBN0KN1NM20150114

Could it possibly be that Maduro really does suck at this leadership thingie? Or is it really Obama's fault?

[tammywammy]

35. Obama colluded with Sauria Arabia to increase production

Get oil so low that our oil production will be halted. It was a long range plan. They also had India and China in on it to lower demand.

[Tarheel_Dem]

36. That seems to be the argument. n/t

[LiberalLovinLug]

54. Yes it does

You think I just pulled it out of wherever?

http://time.com/3648604/saudi-us-dropping-oil-prices/

Did the Saudis and the U.S. Collude in Dropping Oil Prices?
The Saudis and OPEC have a vested interest in taking out higher-cost competitors who will certainly be hurt by the lower price

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_world_/2014/11/19/are_the_united_states_and_saudi_arabia_conspiring_to_keep_oil_prices_down.html

Saudi Arabia Is Fighting an Oil War. But Who’s the Enemy?
The U.S.-Saudi oil alliance is basically taken as a given in the Iranian and Russian media, and the idea got a recent endorsement from New York Times columnist Thomas Friedman as well. Saudi Arabia may indeed want to punish Russia for its support of Bashar al-Assad’s government, and will take any leverage it can get over regional archrival Iran. The U.S., meanwhile, wants to punish Russia for its actions in Ukraine and to pressure Iran into agreeing to a nuclear deal.

http://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2014/10/27/us-saudi-arabia-oil-prices-collusion-calculations-and-errors.html

US - Saudi Arabia Oil Prices Collusion: Calculations and Errors

This is the time the markets should expect oil prices to go up but they go down. It proves that a tacit collusion is taking place between the leading oil exporters and the countries involved, for instance, the United States.

That it hurts both Russia and Argentina is a bonus.


Anyways, I find it somewhat amusing that some Americans still, despite decades of proven false flags, covert CIA destabilization efforts particularly in South America, refuse to believe that their precious government, and its intelligence community together with the world's largest corps would today ever ever be involved in destabilization efforts in Argentina in order to cause social unrest and a change in government that is a thorn in their side and if successful is an inspiration for other SA countries to embrace socialist policies and take back control of their own resources. Maybe you have to live outside the country to see the forest for the trees.

[Tarheel_Dem]

55. That's it! You're very persuasive! I'm a believer! You & your blogs have converted me!

[LiberalLovinLug]

57. hmmmmm

good enough for me.
cheers

[Marksman_91]

58. Wow... You're not really good at reading sarcasm n/t

[mahatmakanejeeves]

50. That animated .gif: I can't stop laughing.

Unfortunately, the kid's probably better than I am.

Back to the flame war.

[EX500rider]

49. "He has taken over the relentless US covert attacks on their economy started under Bush"

You mean the country that buys most of their oil and is their largest export costumer?

Exports - partners:
US 39.1%, China 14.3%, India 12%, Netherlands Antilles 7.8%, Cuba 4.6% (2012)

Doesn't sound like much of a "attack" on their economy.

[branford]

10. Maduro simply needs to make commodity shortages and lines illegal.

That would solve all the country's problems.

[Bacchus4.0]

11. just getting started. Shopping now is limited to certain days of week according to ID number

So if your ID ends with a 0 or 1 you can shop on Mondays, 2-3 tuesdays etc.

-----------------------------


In some places, authorities are also limiting access to shops to certain days according to the consumers' identity card numbers.

The shortages have hurt President Nicolas Maduro's popularity which, according to local pollster Datanalisis, hit 22 percent in December.

Foes say 15 years of socialism under him and predecessor Hugo Chavez are to blame for Venezuela's economic recession, the highest inflation in the Americas, and shortages.

But Maduro, 52, who won election to replace Chavez last year, says a wealthy elite and opposition activists encouraged by Washington and foreign media are carrying out an "economic war" involving hoarding and price-gouging.



Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/r-nighttime-shop-queues-banned-in-three-venezuela-states-amid-shortages-2015-1#ixzz3OpnuLzcn

[forest444]

12. Keep in mind these shortages are largely created by Venezuela's own wholesale monopolies,

and by a well-oiled black-market network managed from Colombia siphoning increasing amounts of merchandise out of Venezuela. Given the nature of much of the financing for this heist on the Colombian end, it would probably be fair to describe this as a snow job.

[creeksneakers2]

40. If there was more of a free market

there wouldn't be a black market.

[forest444]

43. No doubt about it.

But no discussion of Venezuela's crisis would be complete without at least mentioning the element of sabotage.

[joshcryer]

46. You can call it sabotage but it's more greed.

Or hell, just trying to make it.

Think about it. You buy a couple of barrels of gas for a few bucks, take it to Colombia, and pow, sell it for several hundred if not thousands of dollars. Of course the small timers that do this on the regular, using bicycles, floating makeshift rafts, or smuggling it in cars are a drop in the bucket to the military supported cargo containers of the stuff.

Yes, the military allows smuggling entire cargo ships of gas into Colombia (and other places in Latin America), for a tidy bribe, of course.

Venezuela could nip this practice in the bud if they didn't subsidize gas so much.

[forest444]

48. Words of wisdom,

and frankly a preview of what we might expect if the dollar should lose its status as the world's fiat currency. God forbid.

[Tarheel_Dem]

33. It's Obama's fault. Has nothing at all to do with incompetent & corrupt leadership, doncha know?

[COLGATE4]

37. Actually, it's all really a CIA plot, backed by the idle rich in

Venezuela utilizing the evil Colombians next door. Maduro and company are innocent victims caught up in a perfect storm from counterrrevolutionary forces trying to destroy the great Bolivarian paradise they have created.

[Tarheel_Dem]

38. Uh.... Mmmkay?

[COLGATE4]

42. Didn't think necessary to add the 'sarcasm' thingy. Sorry.

[Tarheel_Dem]

44. You just never know these days. The Chavistas have a tendency to point the finger of blame....

at everyone & everything else except where it needs to be pointed.

[brooklynite]

41. "Nighttime shop queues banned"

Beginning next week, people will be required to line up outside their homes to prove they're not lined up outside the shops...

[christx30]

52. That reminds me of the Woody Allen movie "Goin' Bananas":

"Esposito: From this day on, the official language of San Marcos will be Swedish. Silence! In addition to that, all citizens will be required to change their underwear every half-hour. Underwear will be worn on the outside so we can check. Furthermore, all children under 16 years old are now... 16 years old!"

[joshcryer]

47. This may sound morbid, but it could help cut down the murder rate.

[KamaAina]

56. Maybe we could do the same before Black Friday

[Liberal_in_LA]

59. so people have money but products are in short supply