Advice wanted for great relationship... gone...
**Posting this then heading to work... checking back in after I get home**
I've been a DU member for 16 years, and I have to say this is the first time I've felt so nervous about posting anything. Ever. I guess because it's about a personal relationship with a female friend. **deeeep breath** Ok, here goes...
I'm currently in the throes of what was a budding relationship that went suddenly and jarringly off the rails. First, a little backstory. She and I met last summer at work and have been platonically friendly ever since. I know this is a place where progressive thought prevails so I suspect most of you won't blink at the age difference involved. I'm 55 and she's 35. I'm not an ageing Don Juan, not by any stretch. I'm basically shy and when I meet a woman I like it tends to be because we've spent a lot of time together working at close quarters. I'm not now, nor have I ever been what you would call a 'pick up artist'. I suddenly feel like I'm in the middle of the McCarthy hearings lol.
Anyway, Sarah (not her real name) and I pretty much hit it off right away. I was responsible for training her/showing her the ropes on her first day, and that's when the first sparks appeared. I was pleasantly surprised to learn we had a great deal of interests in common, foremost amongst them were a mutual love of Seinfeld and the Simpsons. The first 10 years of the Simpsons, that is haha! But of course our attraction was much more than that, as time would soon reveal. We shared a sense of humor yes, but we soon learned we simply enjoyed each other's company, and perhaps in spite of our age gap enjoyed a similar taste in movies, popular culture, and I guess just in our general outlook on life.
As time went by we tended to rely more and more on texting to communicate, since we rarely actually worked together. We texted Seinfeldian and other kinds of jokey memes and silly stuff for the most part, and to be honest never got flirtatious in either our written language or in person demeanor. We just never really went there. Both of us I think were just comfortable and happy enough in where we were and were going that we never ventured into those waters. Waters which can be choppy if not downright dangerous as we all know too well. Workplace romances are a BIG gamble. So, why ruin everything by inserting high schoolish sexual innuendo into our texts and our in person communications.
From last summer until this January, Sarah and I never got together outside of work. There were signs however that things were changing, beginning in December. And she was the one who took the first bold step. Made the first move. She followed that one up, with several others. First, during one of our texting sessions, Sarah suggested we ought to get together for beer (and pierogies lol) sometime. I agreed, happily, and said absolutely let's do that once all the Covid restrictions are eased up enough, etc. That first move she made, made me very happy. I always liked her, and was open to the possibility of socializing outside of work, but if we both had to wait for me to make the first move... well, we might still be waiting lol. Second, in early January another sign the times were a' changing. One day she was filling in at work for someone and so we would be working together for the first time in probably a few months. I remember it clearly. It's hard to forget because she showed up that day sporting a large gift for me. A poster-sized and heavy wood piece of Seinfeld wall art!! For the uninitiated it was the famous or infamous Kramer painting - the "loathsome, offensive brute" painting - and I loved it! However I was a bit uneasy to receive such a gift like this in front of our coworkers - people talk - but I did nonetheless with grace and a sense of dispatch so as not to make Sarah think I didn't appreciate her thoughtfulness.
Third and fourth. Things started to really change. Later in January one Saturday we were texting our usual fun nonsense when, completely out of the blue, Sarah invited herself to my apartment. It was all very odd and very forced. But I also have to say, it was very, very welcome. Anyway we were texting when she peculiarly asked me what I thought of the Lord of the Rings movies. I said I hadn't seen them and to be honest wasn't really into those kinds of films, but her plan was already in motion and my seeming indifference didn't matter. She said she would put them on a flash drive, along with a few choice music docs because I told her I liked those, and hand deliver them to my place - 20 miles from hers - the next day. Which she did. Along with... her Mom. I know what you're thinking. So did I. And so am I. Still. Anyway, that's another conversation. And fourth... about two weeks later, February 9th to be exact. This time, a couple of days prior, she invited herself over - sans Mom - for our first one on one, in the same room, social visit. She stayed four hours. We played Trivial Pursuit. The whole time lol. We hugged before she left, and that was it. All was good, although I did second guess myself in that I didn't take the opportunity of us being alone at my place to "make a move". To me, it didn't feel right. Yet. What was the hurry? Anyway I felt we were both going in the same direction, although she perhaps was moving a little quicker than I. That was okay though. Or was it.
This is where things start to go off the rails. And they did. Quickly. And precipitously. A few days later, I asked her if she'd like to get together again. Her text tone - normally upbeat, sunny, happy-go-lucky, and literally teeming with emojis of every positive stripe - was NOT good. It was grey, dull, and decidedly disinterested. Her response, to paraphrase, was that she'd be taking the weekend to herself to get ready to start her new job the following week. (She worked somewhere else too). I was fine with that, although a little concerned by the noticeable, darker change in tone. And frankly, the fact that she made no attempt to say something like "another time would work" or "how about a raincheck?" was disconcerting to me. Considering I'd twice welcomed her into my home over the previous half month, I felt I was entitled to nothing more or less than a tactful 'no'. I still feel that way. Anyway, I gracefully accepted her 'no' but expressed my concerns if everything was okay, if she was feeling okay, if we were etc. Next... I got a rapid fire response... ratta-tat-tat... which lit my fuse, and well, things have not been the same since. She said: "I don't share photos, I don't want to hang out this weekend I can't hang out all the time anyway". A little context, the 'share photos' stuff was because I'd just sent her a cute pic of me with my fam as a kid and I kidded her if she had something similar. Annnnn-yway...
What the hell was that?
Things went downhill quickly. And I blame myself almost entirely for the falling out that has sustained to this day. Almost. I over-reacted and let my emotions take over. I didn't like what she said and how she said it. I let her know in no uncertain terms. I felt I had been denied a tactful reply to my question - which I was - but in all honesty I went overboard. I made a federal case out of it, turned it into the crime of the century almost. I was so smitten with this girl I think, that I placed her up on a pedestal, and when you do that to someone they don't have a lot of room up there to move around. They might slip and fall. And when they do, it can be a long way down. Unfair of me in the extreme. I apologized profusely to her for doing that. I also said I was sorry if she had expected more from our 4 hour visit at my place, and that I didn't want to make a clumsy move which might end up embarrassing us both. Which is true... cuz I AM romantically interested, just not rushing. The upshot of all of what happened and the unravelling of our relationship which followed, is that she has not spoken to me since. It's been more than two months. And I am heartsick about all of it.
I know I was wrong to become so angry over her flippant "don't want to hang out" comments, but I also know her version of things - that she said absolutely nothing wrong - isn't correct either. On a scale of one to ten, her comments I think were about a two or three in terms of nastiness, but my reaction was a completely unwarranted 8 or 9. I should've and could've reacted with calm resolve and finesse, using my brain instead of my bruised male ego as a battering ram. Next time she might've suggested we do something socially, I could've been a little nonchalant about my interest, and left it at that. Point made. Quietly and without a lot of jumping around like an ape.
Reading back what I've just written, I admit this all sounds like a badly written version of a John Hughes high school movie from the 80's, but it's all true and what matters, matters to me at least, is how much I am hurting inside because of what's happened between Sarah and I.
After two plus months of silence from her, and after several written attempts at me making things right (right away she told me no phone calls) I am also starting to feel less and less like the bad guy in all this, and more like the only adult in this relationship. The 20 year difference in our ages shouldn't account for her acting like a teenager should it? Refusing to talk to me or to acknowledge anything untoward in how she replied. The woman is 35, not 15. She's just acting like it.
I just want my friend back, whether or not we were meant to be more than that would be determined by time. At the time of this writing the chances of any of this happening do not look good. My feeling - possibly anchored in delusion - is that she WAS and IS upset that I didn't nut up and take a romantic chance with her when she visited me for those four hours on that lovely afternoon. And if "hell hath no fury" is to be believed... then I may be up the creek without a paddle for some time - if not eternity - to come.
I hope not.
Help!
p.s. please!!
= new reply since forum marked as read
Maybe I should give it a whirl, I dunno lol. Cuz my firm but gentle hand was DEFINITELY not at play when Sarah and I spent four bloody hours playing Trivial Pursuit. I didn't lead her anywhere but around the game board.
I do have two left feet but maybe it's not too late to teach this old dog lol. 
You should've done this or that. She should've done this or that. It doesn't really matter what the "this" or "that" are. It doesn't matter where the blame lies at this point. I don't want to sound trite, but it is what it is.
Years ago I had an abrupt breakup with a guy who was substantially older than me. The breakup was my idea. It doesn't matter what the reasons were, though I can tell you they had nothing to do with the age difference in that situation. The point was that I knew it needed to end. He didn't handle it well. Most of us don't handle rejection well. He wrote me a long, pleading letter, explaining his feelings, and wanting to understand. I didn't respond, and the reason I didn't respond was because I knew that responding would just prolong the pain for him, and it would accomplish nothing. I knew it was over. I needed it to be over. [Editing to add: I think I was actually afraid of interacting with him because I didn't want to be talked out of ending things, only to have it go on longer and ultimately end anyway.]
More recently, I was on the receiving end of major rejection. My husband had an affair, and we had a very ugly end to the relationship. Ultimately he chose her. It took me a LONG time to accept that, and it hurt very badly. Rejection hurts, no matter what. In my case it turned out to be the best thing for me, but it took me a long time to figure that out.
Being rejected is SO painful, and logic isn't really likely to help much. It's just going to take some time to get through what you're going through. If you're the kind of person who is receptive to therapy, you might try it. For me, I talked and talked and talked to two people who had experienced the same type of thing, so they understood what I was experiencing. I also watched a whole lot of videos online, and they helped me immensely.
I think what you'll learn is that you really need to go through the loss of this relationship the same way one goes through most types of loss. As painful as it will be, you will have to go through the stages of grief. You're barely starting at this point, but you CAN get through this.
...romantic past. I just hope it wasn't too painful for your to revisit them and that it was more cathartic than anything else. So don't feel bad about making it about 'you'. I think it's only natural for people to compare others situations to their own lives. I'm glad to hear that after all you've been through, especially the feelings of guilt, that you are free and at peace with it all. And happy!
I have myself come to the unavoidable conclusion that my story really is about Sarah, as you suggest, and not me. And you're right sometimes we don't get the answers we crave. We're always looking for explanations, but sometimes they just don't fall into place. It's hard when you really and truly believed you understood someone else and knew what motivated them. Harder still to admit that you just don't, but you have to accept it. None of it is easy. But the sooner I just accept that 'it is what it is', the better off I will be. The only hopes and expectations I should have are the ones I place in myself. If Sarah's journey leads her back to me at some point so be it, but I have to take care of myself first. I'll be no good to anyone, especially her, if at some point down the road she seeks me out and realizes I haven't learned to live and be happy without her.
This weekend for instance I'm finding that I've really grown weary of caring if she 'comes around'. The past 9 or so weeks have drained me, having been largely spent 'caring' at the detriment of my own sense of peace and serenity. I think it's inevitable that a person's self-preservation instincts have to kick in at some point, and that's a healthy thing. I've spent less time this weekend wondering about her state of mind, and if and whether she might do this or say that and things might improve if she did, etc. etc. I'm not being selfish, I'm getting on with my life and accepting that there are some things over which I have no control. That's life, isn't it? 
I'm happy for you.
I just have to say, whoever came up with the saying, "What doesn't kill you makes you stronger" knew what they were talking about.
I have read and reread your post several times & I keep getting a feeling of awkward.
"It was all very odd and very forced." This sums my impression ofwhat you have written.
This lady sounds a bit impulsive and, to be honest, a bit lacking in social decorum. It also sounds like she could very well be continuing to use her childhood defense mechanisms in adult life as many people do, of course unaware of what is driving their behavior. In this case, that of the petulant child. Who knows how that served her in childhood, but it must have worked since she appears to still revert to it. Perhaps this is why you felt like you were interacting with a 15 year old?
What would prompt her to bring you that large poster to work to present to you in front of coworkers? Yikes!
Not sure what her reasoning was for her "gray, dull" response but, if I were you, I'd be really glad you didn't "make a move" with this lady.
Workplace relationships are a big gamble, indeed. Be glad you still have your career intact.
Oftentimes when we meet or develop friendships or romantic attractions to others, we are only seeing a small sliver of that person's character and personality because we only know that person in one domain. In this case, work.
It is always a mistake to presume things about others imo, especially in the case of a workplace potential romantic relationship.
In psychology, the tendency to allow positive impressions of a person in one area to positively influence one's opinion in other areas is refered to as the halo effect.
For example, imagine 2 people meet at a church or charity event and feel chemistry so they get together. One person presumes that because the other person was at the same church or involved in the same charity that they have the same values about relationships, integrity, child rearing, etc., which they might, but they also might not. Obviously, not a good idea to presume.
Dr. John Gottman has done some great research on relationships & written many books that have been helpful to many people, couples included. Reading some of his research might be an eye-opening experience which could serve you well in the future.
I'm really sorry that you are left hurting, missing your friend. I hope you meet someone more compatible and appreciative of your friendship, time, attention, and affections.
What I have learned - the hard way - is that when someone you've had an apparently great relationship with starts to go weird on you, it means they've met someone else and they're trying to edge away without overtly breaking up with you. It hurts but there's nothing to do but move on.
You've hit on a lot of things others here have pointed out and that I have come to accept as being sensible thinking which should inform my own behavior going forward. It's funny you should mention the importance of being able to make someone laugh really hard like that. Maybe I should try and see if I can get Sarah to crack a smile about all of this? I'm thinking of a situation where happenstance puts us together at some point, not as the result of a protracted situation where I might say "let's talk", which would be just loaded with anxiety. I mean, do I really want to tense up around her and give off the impression that I'm still wallowing in sufferance etc., or is it better maybe that I get off a real good one in front of her and then maybe the both of us would rear back and enjoy a good belly laugh? The healing power of laughter. Hmmm... 
The way your friend is shutting people out reminds me of something with my daughter.
When her dad died, she was just 12 years old. He adored her, and she was truly "Daddy's girl". She was just lost for about a year, and then started getting mixed up with some people who weren't on a good path. She blew off all of her good friends. Just recently she told me that the reason she did that was because she didn't want to drag them down into the dark place that she was in at the time.
Some people do the healthy thing and reach out to those who care about them when they're in a dark place, and accept their help. Others shut them out. 
Last edited Sat Apr 24, 2021, 11:36 PM - Edit history (1)
That's really a tough age to lose a dad. I mean, any age is, but I feel like that age is particularly difficult.
Thank you for your good wishes. If you're anything at all in real life like you are on this board, I'm sure you're an amazing friend. I hope that friend of yours realizes that soon.
...and realized it's time to stop posting about this. It's been a great exercise in catharsis, in having others offer me their advice, and I have appreciated it greatly. I have benefitted from everyone's point of view, and am incorporating much of what has been shared with me into my thinking going forward. I realize I have been kind of all over the place as of late in regards to what I might do, I think it's just part of my grieving, healing and moving on. The more that time goes on, the more I am accepting things. So I make no promises as to what if anything I might actually do going forward. I think the best course of action is to just live my life, and to commit to that as opposed to trying to manufacture an outcome more to my liking. I rule nothing out, but am making no plans to do anything at all. It seems to me that the best possible outcome when you lose a cherished relationship, is that if it comes back to you it's without any plotting or planning on your part. That way you can honestly assess whether it's something you still want, or not, because you've moved on. So moving on is key. You might want to go back, you might want to keep moving. But you gotta keep living.
Cheers, all!!
