To DU Proper "visitors" today from a Second Amendment supporter:

[Decoy of Fenris]

I can't speak for RKBA as a whole, but I will say this for myself:


As a proud gun owner and (for the most part) staunch supporter of the Second Amendment, I am mourning this tragic loss of life. Was it preventable? Easily, but that's a matter for another day.

Today is a day of mourning. I, for one, stand alongside the rest of DU in condemning this horrific act of mass violence against innocents.



(If any pro-gun RKBA folks are willing to stand with me as well, demonstrating that we aren't exactly heartless monsters here in the Gungeon, it'd be appreciated. I'll look pretty silly up here all by myself otherwise. )

[gateley]

1. I'm not a gun owner, but many of us know you're not all villains! And others

have expressed similar sentiments,

We know you're the good guys and the only difference between us is that you own guns, we don't.

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

18. Thanks

[Decoy of Fenris]

27. Thank you, brother.

It's much appreciated.

[gateley]

39. I'm a sister, and you're welcome.

[Eleanors38]

32. Thank you.

[DURHAM D]

2. I am curious...

Why does owning a gun make you proud?

This is an honest question. I am a gun owner (actually I inherited them) but "proud" is not an emotion I associate with same.

[Decoy of Fenris]

5. Because the guns I own are historical icons, for the most part.

I'm proud of my collection for both it's historic value as well as the quality of the guns make. Each of their stories is as unique as any person's, and I'm quite fond of telling each of theirs. I suppose it would be similar to me being proud of my collection of antique and limited-edition books, some over a hundred and fifty years old.

[graham4anything]

34. So why do you need bullets? Keep your guns in a collectors showcase like a baseball fan does

and I waited til after midnight eastern to post this.

Guns in the street can be stopped with all guns banned from the street.

just add security and yes, more security and even more security to secure the perimeter of anything

[gejohnston]

10. perhaps he meant "not ashamed"

perhaps there is a better term to use.

[Decoy of Fenris]

13. No, I do mean Proud.

My collection was difficult to assemble and in a few cases required extra effort to obtain. I am proud of my collection in the same way a bottle-cap collector is proud of his vintage Pepsi caps.

[NewMoonTherian]

30. Guns are tools...

that enable a person to protect the people he or she loves. Many lifestyles also include hunting as a source of food and income. There is no shortage of reasons one might be proud to own and use guns.

[Eleanors38]

35. My guns (chiefly for hunting) are factory-made,

high quality, long-lasting and inexpensive products. They are great examples of American production philosophy. They work for a living, and will pass on when I do. I'm proud I was wise enough to know the value of this.

[Kolesar]

3. What does your subject line mean? eom

[Decoy of Fenris]

6. It's actually a statement on multiple levels.

Primarily, that the facts of issues are a fundamental existence to most of my arguments here on DU; I strive for factual accuracy as much as a historian can, given that we are all mortal and history tends to be written by the victor. Truth, likewise facing a bias of opinion, must be aimed and directed by as much fact as possible, and when armed with both, one can prevail in any argument.

Secondarily, that it is a statement (tongue in cheek) on the notion that "Truth is a loaded gun", a song by Rachael Byrnes, depicting honesty being as much a "killer" as a lie.

There's a few others, but they are more personal to me. I will provide them if you wish.


ON EDIT: Oh, SUBJECT line. My apologies, I misread that as "Signature". My subject line is a reference to any potential visitors from "DU proper", a term I use since the Gungeon is often disassociated with the rest of DU.

[Kolesar]

7. who or what is "DU proper visitors" eom

[Decoy of Fenris]

8. Edited above post.

"DU Proper" is a term I've coined to mean "The rest of DU", as opposed to the Gungeon, since the Gungeon seems to have it's own separate ecology.

[Kolesar]

9. The typical mode of the gungeon is to mock me and talk around the issues, ...

then descend into a round of self-congratulatory hyena barks

[Decoy of Fenris]

11. You have to remember one thing, Kolestar.

DU Proper is united on most issues; there may be minor differences of opinion, but for the most part, they are united.

Here in the Gungeon, we are a minority opinion, but a drastically different one, than DU Proper. If you come here, you are walking into essentially an area that directly contradicts a view held by most DUers, and you will likely be confronted about it. To most of us here in RKBA, the "problem" of guns is a non-issue; the problem is what -causes- people to use guns. Crime, mental illness, et cetera. It is a largely held belief that the person doing the murdering is the murderer, not the gun, and to condemn guns for killings is nonsensical at best and a direct assault on constitutionally-granted rights at worst.

In comparison, DU Proper is an echo chamber of opinion. RKBA is a free-for-all of opinions, and it really helps in such debates to have valid statistics (Neither Brady Camp nor NRA) to bring to your arguments. It gives loads of credibility.

[Kolesar]

20. Your original post is not empathetic*, it is opportunistic

*empathetic to the dozens of dead people.

You are trying to launch an argument that a bad thing happened, but the weaponized free for all in America was not the cause.

[Decoy of Fenris]

23. No, I am not.

The above post was answering the potential question of why you were "attacked" in the Gungeon. I neither support the acts of this shooter, nor will I be discussing gun control or a lack thereof today, either for or against. It is my personal belief that you are attempting to elicit an argument from me with this post, but you will not find one. I take my leave of this particular subthread with you, and wish you the best otherwise.

[holdencaufield]

14. You believe DU RKBA Group exists just to mock you?

Self-obsess much?

[Kolesar]

16. Shooting Friday, report to DU for the ultimate fights...eom

[gejohnston]

17. do you talk about the issues?

one liners tend to attract snark. Thoughtful discussion does not.

[Kolesar]

24. "Two"

I expect there are five more to be seen

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

28. Two what? n/t

[tortoise1956]

4. How could anyone not be disgusted by this vile act?

This cowardly fuck shot innocent babies. I have 4 grandchildren, and I would be shattered if this had happened to one of them.

[MotherPetrie]

12. Why in the FUCK are you PROUD of owning guns?

[holdencaufield]

15. I'm proud ...

... of the finely crafted firearms that I own. I'm proud that I have taken a lot of time to know how to use them proficiently and safely and I'm proud that, if the situation ever arose, I am more than capable of using them to both provide for and protect myself and those who I hold dear.

Are you proud of anything?

[Decoy of Fenris]

19. I posted that upthread.

Because my collection is both unique and holds high historic value as well as high functionality, given their time periods. My most common weapon, my 1919 M1 Mosin Nagant, is still in it's prime and is both incredibly accurate as well as exceptionally maintained. Fairly rare, reliable and durable. I could get into the historic aspect, but I'd wager you'd rather not hear that at the moment.

[gejohnston]

22. they are a symbol of the culture I grew up in,

and I'm proud of that culture. As it is, I'll go back as soon as I convince the wife that Florida sucks more than the snow.

[NewMoonTherian]

26. Speaking only for myself...

I'm proud of the fact that I've taken the steps necessary to protect and provide for my family.

[oneshooter]

33. Many of my collection are family heirlooms

They will be pased down ot my sons and their families. Many are of historical value, some are just accurate works of art.

[sarisataka]

21. I second and stand with you

We all mourn today. My kindergartner gets to sleep with his mother and me tonight

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

25. I'm with you

Horrible crimes committed by mental case. Sad.

[NewMoonTherian]

29. Well spoken, friend.

It should go without saying that I'm horrified by these actions. I'm praying for peace and comfort for the families of those killed by this monster.

[Eleanors38]

31. I'll stand with you. Thank you for the privilege.

[Glaug-Eldare]

36. I'm with ya, DoF.

I've never been one to be moved to tears or nausea by news stories about carnage, but I can certainly recognize tragedy when I hear it. Twenty-seven human beings died yesterday for no reason, and so many opportunities and beginnings were taken away. I'm not comfortable focusing so tightly on one disaster when there's so much more suffering done one at a time, but the story is just too sad not to concentrate on. I hope the victims' families and friends can find some source of comfort. If the victims live on somewhere, I hope they find a better place than this world was for them.

[Kennah]

37. Another one here

Perhaps this will start the ball rolling to address mental health in this country. It is the thread that runs through many horrific acts.

[Spryguy]

38. Well...

if you are proud of them as historical icons, then you would agree that there is no need to have ammo for them. Put them in a glass case with other relics, where they belong.

[Hells Liberal]

40. Amen Decoy of Fenris!

Testify!

[needledriver]

41. Thank you for your post

On DU it is impossible to express any appreciation of firearms as tools, as craftsmanship, as art, as technology, or as history without swiftly attracting responses with ALL CAPS and many !!!!!!!11!!!!!! exclamation points.

I am a Left Coast blue voting quiche eating Liberal. I respect and appreciate firearms for all of the reasons stated above, and I am as shocked and horrified as anyone over the searing loss of innocent life.

I stand with you.

[friendly_iconoclast]

42. I'm with you, DoF. This incident gutted me.