Racism

[MrScorpio]

“The problem is that white people see racism as conscious hate, when racism is bigger than that. Racism is a complex system of social and political levers and pulleys set up generations ago to continue working on the behalf of whites at other people’s expense, whether whites know/like it or not. Racism is an insidious cultural disease. It is so insidious that it doesn’t care if you are a white person who likes black people; it’s still going to find a way to infect how you deal with people who don’t look like you. Yes, racism looks like hate, but hate is just one manifestation. Privilege is another. Access is another. Ignorance is another. Apathy is another. And so on.

So while I agree with people who say no one is born racist, it remains a powerful system that we’re immediately born into. It’s like being born into air: you take it in as soon as you breathe. It’s not a cold that you can get over. There is no anti-racist certification class. It’s a set of socioeconomic traps and cultural values that are fired up every time we interact with the world. It is a thing you have to keep scooping out of the boat of your life to keep from drowning in it. I know it’s hard work, but it’s the price you pay for owning everything.”
— Scott Woods (via newwavefeminism)

http://newwavefeminism.tumblr.com/

[Squinch]

1. I will never understand why this is such a difficult concept for so many to grasp.

[MrScorpio]

2. They don't want to understand it… Because it's not their belief.

They're also quite used to believing that what ever they say, it has to be the definitive word on ANY GIVEN SUBJECT.

[Squinch]

3. Which makes it just a big ugly vicious circle.

[MrScorpio]

4. I look at it as a test of character...

This entire white privilege debate. Whites who admit that it exists and are doing something to create equality for everyone are the ones who obviously pass that test.

The ones who fail, however, usually fail miserably.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

6. Even if we pass that test

there are plenty still to fail. In the meat world, I'm much more reserved with people I only know casually, and have a strong dislike for conflict, which makes it tough for me to push myself to say something when someone says something bigoted, even though I know silence only perpetuates the bigotry. Sometimes I speak up, sometimes I fail.

[MrScorpio]

8. And you have to speak up, that's part of the test too

The thing with being a white person, especially if you're not completely known to some other white person, is that someone who adheres to racist beliefs will let their guard down and tell you how they believe.

They'd say something to you that they'd never say to a person of color's face. That's especially true up north. Which is funny, because when it comes to white southerners, they're more likely to wear their beliefs on their sleeves for everyone else to see. That was something that I learned from being down south.

White southerners are used to being in close proximity to black people, more so than the north. Up here, entire cities were and are usually segregated and you can run into whites that haven't met a black person at all.

Personally, I consider isolated northern whites to be way more scarier to deal with than any southern good ol' boy. I've known quite a few cool good ol' boys who know what the deal is, because they live it everyday.

It's whites who aren't used to dealing with racial politics in this country and only get their view points from racist assholes like Beck and Hannity who are the real problems. Those fuckers really don't know any better.

[lovemydog]

13. And that's exactly what Dr. King said when he visited

northern cities during his poor people's movement. Well, not exactly. But in spirit.

[freshwest]

42. I've done that so many times, tell them they're wrong to their face. Strange, though, whenever

I had a black person with me, they would tell me to 'let it go.' I would do so if they said, but when I was with all whites, no.

Although those times were not dangerous, even if I got called a name, I wasn't being physically threatened.

At times I wouldn't speak up for myself from cheap shots, because to me, they were not worth my time and effort. A roll of the eyes was all they'd get, besides a permanent posting on my shit list if they kept on with it.

Questions for you:

Why did the blacks want me to back down in defending them, when they were just taking it?

Were their reasons the same as mine?

Or as I wondered, but didn't ask, were they trying to protect me from trouble with whites?

POC I've known have gone out of their way to protect me from harm of all kinds and I've felt comfortable in all the situations I've been in with POC.

What am I missing?

[rurallib]

5. Plus very few will willingly give up their priveleges to help another

[MrScorpio]

7. I think that that's one part of it...

Last edited Mon Jul 21, 2014, 10:31 AM - Edit history (2)

But, I've always said that the best thing about privilege is that it gives the people who have it an excuse to deny that it even exists.

Their privilege is normality to them, they are the default. They think that it gives them carte blanche to define all others as they see themselves, and usually that would mean that anyone unlike themselves can be classified as inferior.

They also have no idea, that in a lot of cases, they ain't all that good anyway.

I've got a PERFECT example right here:

girlwitch003-deactivated2014072 asked:your honestly just an ugly nigger
langsettte:

omg guys! i literally just installed this thing where people who *think* they’re clicking on anon, aren’t. and well well well look what we have here

me:



you:



what kind of extreme inbreeding teas! what kind of i live on a ranch and sneak into the barn every night and have sex with my brother and my horse teas?

and of course, you follow me. proof that in general, hate mail comes from fans who’s presence we are literally unaware of



I mean I could go on but I’m literally beyond embarrassed on your behalf i hope your future employer at the gas station sees this and decides not to hire you you ugly squidward bitch

http://ineedabflol.tumblr.com/post/92396825868/your-honestly-just-an-ugly-nigger

[JustAnotherGen]

9. I'm confused by this

I don't do tumblr so what am I missing here? The caucasian girl in the second picture posted something nasty to the black woman - and the black woman was able to find out who the girl was?

[MrScorpio]

10. OK.

The problem with Tumblr is that trolls tend to post absolute bullshit on other folk's blog posts without showing who they are. The girl posted some racist shit thinking that she was doing it anonymously, but the black girl whose blog she posted to has a fix that makes people think that they're posting anonymously, and ALL of their ID info is plain to see to the blog owner.

I'm sure that the racist white girl was caught by surprise when her ID and face behind that shit became plain to see.

That was winner for sure.

[JustAnotherGen]

11. Thank you - It's monday

And I'm slow on the uptake.

And with clarity . . . It makes me wonder how quick some people all over the internet would be to post bigoted nonsense and 'who me the innocent?' snotty stuff if they could be exposed.

Kind of makes you wonder. . .

[MrScorpio]

12. That's the fucked up thing about the net, the anonymity and the animosity that comes with it nt

[hfojvt]

17. and the ugly language was just icing on the cake

"I mean I could go on (about inbreeding and 'teas' (whatever that is) and how ugly you are) but I’m literally beyond embarrassed on your behalf i hope your future employer at the gas station sees this and decides not to hire you you ugly squidward bitch."


Oh well, at least she's beautiful - on the outside.

"The nonviolent resister would contend that in the struggle for human dignity, the oppressed people of the world must not succumb to the temptation of becoming bitter or indulging in hate campaigns. To retaliate in kind would do nothing but intensify the existence of hate in the universe."

[MrScorpio]

20. So, you feel it necessary to diminish someone's own outrage at being the target of racism?

It's not as if she actively sought out the white woman who called her a "nigger," to insult her, after that white woman thought she was posting anonymously, now did she?

All being equals here, that black woman had every right to give back what she got. Even more so, since she was willing to show her own face when she said it.

So, why does the black woman have to be the only one to "behave" herself here.

Where is your outrage at the woman who called her a "nigger?"

[ieoeja]

18. Probably shouldn't have gone with a picture of the girl sick and in a hospital bed, however.

I'm not into pulling punches where racists are concerned. But she does make fun of the girl's appearance. I'm guessing she didn't notice the bed railing and the tubes.

[MrScorpio]

21. I don't have a problem with it at all

It was obviously gleaned from her own Tumblr account for all to see.

She had no reason to insult the black woman who caught her red handed.

[lunasun]

39. +1

[hfojvt]

14. so there we are right back to it

So it's not "the system," white people really are bad.

They all look alike. So I look like Matt Damon, but also like Rob Ford.

They always think they are right (because apparently they always all agree, so when ONE white person says something, they think that is the definitive word on the subject because no other white male (or white female, but hey, they are probably sexist too (and born into that system that automatically provides them with all these benefits (and yet so very, very many white males are poor as dirt (go figure))))

They pretend (or think) they know everything too - ANY GIVEN SUBJECT.

Are there any more negative sweeping generalizations you wanna make about white people?

[MrScorpio]

15. Are you familiar with the concepts of Whitesplaining and Mansplaining?

It's usually done as a form of privilege exercise.

Because that's what I'm talking about here.

[hfojvt]

19. you mean the terms that some people use

to belittle white people and males?

[MrScorpio]

22. Is that how you feel about it?

So do you believe that white people and males are entitled to reinterpret the language and experiences of people of color and women, in order to force feed their own definitions from both a white and male perspective alone?

[Skittles]

43. the answer to that is a big fat YES

yes INDEED

[noiretextatique]

28. yes...it is really our secret desire to belittle white people and males

your vigilance has finally paid-off. the sole purpose of research on the subject of race and gender is to make YOU feel bed. poor you.

[mountain grammy]

23. My read is, it is "the system" and I agree..

[noiretextatique]

26. you really are uninformed, the uninformed always take it to a personal level

even when most of the social science community...and the research done on the subject indicates it IS NOT a personal issue...at least not systemic, institutional racism. YOU continue to be a part of the problem because of your inability to accept the concept, not because the concept is invalid. as always, you proved the op's point very nicely.

[Squinch]

27. Do you really not get it or are you pretending not to get it? I am white, and I have no trouble

understanding the truth of what the OP is talking about.

You say this same thing all the time. Do you really not understand? Do you really feel that you are being personally wronged by these very truthful observations?

[noiretextatique]

29. funny how

this poster comes into everything thread about racism, only to point out that he is the biggest victim on the planet. never fails.

[Squinch]

31. The poor thing. Because when someone says "entitlement" it's just an arrow in his heart.

[noiretextatique]

34. i don't think i will need to do that

i've never seen you acting like one the defenders of this system. as i see it, either you are a part of the solution, or you are a part of problem. unfortunately, being a part of the problem was/is the norm for some.

[Squinch]

36. But the thing is that all of us who are in entitled groups carry it.

It's like peeling an onion. I am down to the little layers, but I'm sure there are still some things I haven't examined. I am lucky enough to have friends, though, who feel no compunctions about pointing it out when they see it. Rather than being insulted, I am simply amazed at how deeply ingrained racism is in cultural references and attitudes.

[noiretextatique]

37. good point...i remember an exercise i had to do in college that opened my eyes

the exercise was the embrace ALL my ancestors. i had no problem embracing my african and first nations ancestors, but i had some resistance to embracing my ancestors who owned slaves and fought for the confederacy. it was a real eye-opener for me about my own consciousness and journey. being a part of the solution is very personal, and it does require internal examination, and it is a lifelong exercise. compare and contract someone like you, to some other people (who shall remain nameless) and it is clear to me that some choose not to do that work. and that choice is a part of privilege, as is the outright rejection of the concept. there is no sense in pretending we ALL are not and have not infected by the insidious disease of racism, yet the other privilege, denial, is a rejection of that notion...that somehow one can grow up in a diseased system, yet not be affected by the disease. isn't that the GOP's message. btw? that racism doesn't *really* exist, unless white people are the victims? another RW talking point that's perfectly acceptable here.

[Squinch]

38. I am a woman, and I even still have to work on excising sexist attitudes.

For both racism and sexism, though, I think there has to be a moment where the enormity of them, their pervasiveness, becomes clear. I think before we have that moment, we can blithely think, "Yeah, I have that covered. I'm not a racist, I'm not a sexist." But for me, for both "isms" there were moments where some incident opened my eyes and only afterward did I see how both racism and sexism are EVERYWHERE. After you see it, you can't un-see it, but before you see it, you can be pretty unaware of it.

[noiretextatique]

40. like fish swimming in water

it is hard to see something that is so pervasive. and that blindness affords one ability to pretend water isn't wet, i suppose. i mean really...why on earth is discussing racism or sexism or any ism STILL about parsing definitions of the thing, or claiming discussing the thing is in fact the thing itself...in a country with such a long, ugly, painful history? it's a fascinating, albeit strange type of dissonance some choose, and i do believe it is a choice, though probably fueled by the thing itself. a vicious cycle.

[Squinch]

41. Exactly. "Parsing definitions or claiming discussing the thing is the thing itself."

[Skittles]

44. there are plenty of them who REALLY.DO.NOT.UNDERSTAND.

it's just very disconcerting indeed to see them on a Democratic site

[Squinch]

45. I think you are right. And I wonder at the effort it must take to so stubbornly not understand.

[Skittles]

46. I don't think it takes much effort at all

the sense of entitlement has been with them from day one so it's their natural state......when they feel "threatened", they lash out no matter how illogical it sounds to those who have long been reminded they are not entitled

[noiretextatique]

25. +1000

it's really not rocket science. miseducation plays a large role. just the other day i read about a "textbook" being used in arizona that asserts the following: white people "envied" the "freedom" of slaves...or something to that effect. when people are being taught such nonsense, i can understand why the complexities of racism are lost on them.

[Squinch]

30. I heard about that. And yes, children taught from such a book have a lot to overcome if they are to

ever understand anything.

But let's not ignore the monumental racism that went into making that textbook. Some idiot, it is true, needed to write it, but then armies of people had to approve it, companies had to agree to print it knowing full well what it said, entire town boards needed to approve its use, and scores of parents had to NOT show up at the PTA meeting carrying pitchforks and clubs and demanding that it not be used.

That right there is institutional racism at work.

[noiretextatique]

32. you are so correct...it is a perfect example of the kind of systemic racism

the author is talking about. thanks...perhaps even the defensive one can grasp this example

[Squinch]

33. Don't bet on it.

[noiretextatique]

35. ...

[jwirr]

16. This vicious cycle can be broken if a family is serious about breaking it. My family faught in the

Civil War but that did not make any difference in their attitude toward others. It did not stop until the 60s when it became unpopular to call others names. Us kids were the first to change and we let our parents know that it was wrong. In the end my mother was even telling her friends to stop. But it was not just the name calling. When we got to college in the 70s our family actively worked with minorities and became friends. We learned that all people are not so very different as we have been taught.

My sister married a man from Jamaica and my children are married to Native Americans who also have black ancestry. I do not think the intermarriage was part of the change - it was the result. And THIS is what the white population is afraid of. They are also afraid of becoming the minority because they completely know how minorities are treated. They made the rules.

[DesertDiamond]

24. We will have equality and respect for all, and the peace that comes with it. This will happen soon..

Personally, I do all I can to change this situation. I don't have much power in this world in the conventional sense, but I can chant and take action. And fortunately, all of our efforts will bear that beautiful fruit we dream of.