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cleanhippie

(19,705 posts)
Fri Apr 24, 2015, 11:58 AM Apr 2015

Pope ‘personally’ rejects France’s gay ambassador to the Vatican

The Pope has personally met with France’s proposed ambassador to the Vatican – to tell him his appointment will be blocked because he is gay.

The French government has refused to back down after selecting openly gay diplomat Laurent Stefanini to head to the home of the Catholic Church – which remains actively opposed to LGBT rights.

However, the Vatican has snubbed the country’s selection of ambassador – refusing to answer the nomination in a bid to get it withdrawn.

Pope Francis, who as the head of the Catholic Church is the sovereign of Vatican City, met with Mr Stefanini this week to personally reject him.

According to Reuters, the Pontiff met with the diplomat to tell him that he will not be allowed to become the country’s diplomat, because of his sexuality. Mr Stefanini is single, but the Pope also reportedly raised concerns about same-sex marriage.

http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2015/04/24/pope-personally-rejects-frances-gay-ambassador-to-the-vatican/



Wonder Pope! The bestest and most progressive Pope ever!
24 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Pope ‘personally’ rejects France’s gay ambassador to the Vatican (Original Post) cleanhippie Apr 2015 OP
I'm sure his champions here will applaud this skepticscott Apr 2015 #1
How judgmental bvf Apr 2015 #3
Go get 'em, Frank! bvf Apr 2015 #2
Hey, give PopeAwesome some credit! Arugula Latte Apr 2015 #4
Baby steps, right? bvf Apr 2015 #5
Who knows, maybe it will happen in 3000. Arugula Latte Apr 2015 #6
France should now severe all relations with the Vatican Kelvin Mace Apr 2015 #7
The Catholic Laity needs to sever relations. cleanhippie Apr 2015 #8
No, because people here and elsewhere skepticscott Apr 2015 #15
They ignored the nins at their own peril! cleanhippie Apr 2015 #19
that went well the last time they tried it, LOL.... mike_c Apr 2015 #9
Absolutely right. bvf Apr 2015 #13
Why have an ambassador to a small city-state TlalocW Apr 2015 #10
Because it's rich as all fucking get-out bvf Apr 2015 #11
Yay Wonderpope Frank! Who is he to judge, indeed! trotsky Apr 2015 #12
Here's the Reuters report, the source of the OP. rug Apr 2015 #14
The Holy See signed the Vienna Convention in April 1961 struggle4progress Apr 2015 #16
Pope Francis meets with gay French ambassador nominee struggle4progress Apr 2015 #17
The more important question is locks Apr 2015 #18
Never gonna happen. Too many defend and carry water for the RCC. Just look upthread. cleanhippie Apr 2015 #20
Replying to the usual broadbrushes posting the usual shit. rug Apr 2015 #22
Glad to see he's quit stalling and showed his true colours. beam me up scottie Apr 2015 #21
it's like clockwork. edhopper Apr 2015 #23
And the cut-and-paste excerpts allow them to hide behind other's bigotry. beam me up scottie Apr 2015 #24
 

skepticscott

(13,029 posts)
1. I'm sure his champions here will applaud this
Fri Apr 24, 2015, 12:07 PM
Apr 2015

as "baby steps". And will be "cautiously optimistic" that he will transform the church into a decent, non-bigoted organization some time in this millennium. Or respond with 17 irrelevant Google search results. Or post 5 more articles slamming atheists. Or argue that people who aren't directly affected have no right or reason to complain about this. Or deflect the whole issue by regaling us with plans for their summer Italian holiday. It wouldn't even be above some posters here to just call atheists "assholes" (or should I say "arseholes"?) for daring to make an issue of this.

 

bvf

(6,604 posts)
2. Go get 'em, Frank!
Fri Apr 24, 2015, 12:07 PM
Apr 2015

Meet with the guy in person so you can spit in his face!

Is religion great, or what?

 

Arugula Latte

(50,566 posts)
4. Hey, give PopeAwesome some credit!
Fri Apr 24, 2015, 12:16 PM
Apr 2015

At least he didn't burn him at the stake in Saint Peter's Square. The Church is really evolving!

 

bvf

(6,604 posts)
5. Baby steps, right?
Fri Apr 24, 2015, 12:24 PM
Apr 2015

At this rate, we'll be seeing the RCC's LGBT acceptance by about the year 4000.

Call me a cock-eyed optimist.


 

Arugula Latte

(50,566 posts)
6. Who knows, maybe it will happen in 3000.
Fri Apr 24, 2015, 12:26 PM
Apr 2015

I mean, look at the lightning speed at which the Church issued an apology to Galileo. That only took 450 years.

 

Kelvin Mace

(17,469 posts)
7. France should now severe all relations with the Vatican
Fri Apr 24, 2015, 12:28 PM
Apr 2015

There need to be consequences for irrational bigotry.

 

skepticscott

(13,029 posts)
15. No, because people here and elsewhere
Fri Apr 24, 2015, 02:36 PM
Apr 2015

keep stumping for the "change from within" bullshit, which only supports and perpetuates this kind of fundamental bigotry.

But..Soup Kitchens!! And Dawkins is a meanie!!

cleanhippie

(19,705 posts)
19. They ignored the nins at their own peril!
Fri Apr 24, 2015, 06:15 PM
Apr 2015

That was a PR nightmare. Those nuns really made waves and caused change. Or something.

 

bvf

(6,604 posts)
13. Absolutely right.
Fri Apr 24, 2015, 01:12 PM
Apr 2015

I've said elsewhere that other countries should play the same gambit and expose this homophobic monolith for what it is.

TlalocW

(15,430 posts)
10. Why have an ambassador to a small city-state
Fri Apr 24, 2015, 12:37 PM
Apr 2015

That doesn't produce anything except excuses for how their priests behave?

TlalocW

 

bvf

(6,604 posts)
11. Because it's rich as all fucking get-out
Fri Apr 24, 2015, 01:01 PM
Apr 2015

and still represents a significant (though declining, from all reports) portion of the population?

 

rug

(82,333 posts)
14. Here's the Reuters report, the source of the OP.
Fri Apr 24, 2015, 01:15 PM
Apr 2015
Pope met French Vatican envoy nominee at center of gay speculation


(Reuters) - Pope Francis has held a private meeting with France's nominee as ambassador to the Holy See, the French government said on Wednesday in the latest twist in a months-long stand-off over the Vatican's failure to confirm his posting.

Paris nominated the government's head of protocol, Laurent Stefanini, for the post on Jan. 5 but has still not heard back from the Vatican - a delay that French and Italian media have said is due to his homosexuality.

"There was a meeting between the Pope and Mr Stefanini," government spokesman Stephane Le Foll told a regular briefing, confirming a report by satirical weekly Le Canard Enchaine but dismissing the newspaper's assertion that his candidacy had been finally rejected during the April 18 meeting.

"Nothing has changed: France has proposed a candidate and for the time being we are waiting for the Vatican's reply after the usual discussions and review of his candidacy."

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/04/22/us-pope-france-idUSKBN0ND1I620150422

struggle4progress

(118,701 posts)
16. The Holy See signed the Vienna Convention in April 1961
Fri Apr 24, 2015, 04:28 PM
Apr 2015
... Article 4 ... #2. The receiving State is not obliged to give reasons to the sending State for a refusal of agrément ... Article 9 #1. The receiving State may at any time and without having to explain its decision, notify the sending State that the head of the mission or any member of the diplomatic staff of the mission is persona non grata or that any other member of the staff of the mission is not acceptable ...

struggle4progress

(118,701 posts)
17. Pope Francis meets with gay French ambassador nominee
Fri Apr 24, 2015, 04:32 PM
Apr 2015

By Andrea Gagliarducci

Vatican City, Apr 24, 2015 / 11:00 am (CNA).- Pope Francis met April 17 with Laurent Stefanini, the openly gay foreign service officer named by France to be ambassador to the Vatican. News of the private audience, which was kept strictly confidential, was reported April 22 by the French magazine Le Canard Enchainé, although the magazine said that the meeting took place April 18. A source from the Vatican Secretariat of State told CNA that the meeting actually took place in the late evening of April 17, and confirmed that it lasted about 15 minutes ... According to diplomatic right, a State can reject the request for accreditation of an ambassador, without giving any explanation about the reasons why. A State can even decide not to give a response at all to the request for accreditation of the new ambassador ... In order to receive Holy See diplomatic approval, ambassadors appointed to the Holy See must meet certain prerequisites and must behave in accordance with Church teaching. For example, an ambassador to the Holy See cannot be a divorced and civilly remarried person ...

http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/pope-francis-meets-with-gay-french-ambassador-nominee-72369/

locks

(2,012 posts)
18. The more important question is
Fri Apr 24, 2015, 05:53 PM
Apr 2015

why does France (or the USA and 180 other states) have diplomatic relations and send ambassadors to Vatican City but not to Mecca, Jerusalem, or any other "religious" city?
From C.P.G.Grey Vatican City Explained: "The King of Vatican City (the Pope) has absolute unchecked power within the country's borders and his presence makes Vatican City one of only six remaining absolute monarchies in the world. The King's absolute power is one reason why Vatican City cannot join the European Union because only democracies are allowed." C.P.G. Grey, Vatican City Explained.
The Holy See was made a nonmember permanent observer of the United Nations in 1964 and given full rights of membership except voting in 2004. The only other "nonmember" is the State of Palestine. Israel is not considered "a Jewish state."

The Center for Reproductive Law and Policy: "..the status of the Holy See as a nonmember permanent observer to the UN is questionable. Moreover, there are doubts about whether in 1964 the UN is creating a precedent for similar claims by other religions. To ensure that the UN does not promote one particular religious view religious entities such as the Roman Catholic Church should not be permitted to participate in that body as nonmember states."

We can only hope France will tell the Vatican it is not interested in sending an ambassador and 180 other states will follow.

cleanhippie

(19,705 posts)
20. Never gonna happen. Too many defend and carry water for the RCC. Just look upthread.
Fri Apr 24, 2015, 06:16 PM
Apr 2015

The usual suspects with the usual responses defending the usual shit.

beam me up scottie

(57,349 posts)
21. Glad to see he's quit stalling and showed his true colours.
Fri Apr 24, 2015, 06:27 PM
Apr 2015

But according to the usual apologist we can't know for sure that it's because he's gay since the Vienna Convention allows the state to "reject the request for accreditation of an ambassador, without giving any explanation about the reasons why".

And Frank didn't come right out and say he's a homophobic bigot.

So there.



beam me up scottie

(57,349 posts)
24. And the cut-and-paste excerpts allow them to hide behind other's bigotry.
Fri Apr 24, 2015, 11:08 PM
Apr 2015

"Horror of Horrors! The Pope thinks marriage is a good thing!"

It's not me that's saying these things, it's the pope/church/website.

Clever.
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