Minnesota archdiocese faces charges over mishandling of sex abuse claims

[Eugene]

Source: Associated Press

Minnesota archdiocese faces charges over mishandling of sex abuse claims

Associated Press in St Paul, Minnesota
Friday 5 June 2015 19.19 BST

Authorities in Minnesota are filing criminal charges against the Roman Catholic archdiocese of St Paul and Minneapolis over its handling of clergy sex abuse claims.

Prosecutors are announcing the charges at a news conference in St Paul. The charges name the archdiocese as a whole. The six counts allege the archdiocese failed to protect children.

The charges stem from the archdiocese’s handling of a case involving the Reverend Curtis Wehmeyer.

Church leaders were accused of failing to immediately report allegations of abuse by Wehmeyer, who pleaded guilty in 2012 to molesting two brothers and was sentenced to five years in prison.

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/jun/05/minnesota-archdiocese-sex-abuse-mishandling-charges

[Warren Stupidity]

1. Good. They can't bankrupt their way out of criminal charges. nt.

[rug]

2. You can't incarcerate a corporation either.

[Cartoonist]

3. Priests in jail

I'd like to see it.

[rug]

4. Anyone in particular or all of them?

[Cartoonist]

5. All the pedophiles

And all theIr enablers.

[rug]

10. I see a theme.

And who do you consider enablers?

[Cartoonist]

20. George Pell

And those who transferred pedophiles instead of turning them in to authorities. We'll need to build more prisons if justice were to be done.

I find it telling that you don't see anything prosecutable here.

[rug]

21. Agreed. And where do you get the idea I think there's nothing prosecuatble?

That is what is telling.

[Cartoonist]

24. By asking

When you ask "who should go to jail", it implies that you can't think of anyone.

[Warren Stupidity]

7. All the ones responsible. Wouldn't you agree?

[rug]

11. I do. And what percentage of priests is that?

[Warren Stupidity]

14. All the ones involved in this specific case.

That would be 100% of the priests involved.

[rug]

16. That doesn't answer the question.

What percentage of RCC priests are involved in pedophilia?

[Warren Stupidity]

17. I have no idea, nor do you.

However all the ones who are or have been involved ought to be in jail.

[rug]

18. I do. Between 2% and 4%.

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Child_sexual_abuse_in_the_Roman_Catholic_Church

[Warren Stupidity]

23. " at least 4%"

according to your link. The reality is that we simply don't know. We can guess. Good job though using rationalwiki. Remember that the next time you object to it as a source.

[rug]

29. That's simply one sorce. Others put it at 2%.

If you want journals, you'll find plenty through your google. It's not hard.

There are two points you're awkwardly evading:

One, the percentage of pedophiles is roughly equivalent to the general population.

Two, 95% of priests are not.

[Warren Stupidity]

34. The source you cited said "at least 4%".

You then arbitrarily lowered that to 2-4%. In other words, you misrepresented the source you cited. Some people would say that doing something like that is making a dishonest argument. Back-filling by claiming that there are other sources that support your claim would also be considered, by some people, at the least, disingenuous.

[AtheistCrusader]

28. The amount of abusers isn't shocking or unusual.

The rank and file coverup, stonewalling, and re-homing offenders in new places so they can continue to abuse, that's the main problem.

[rug]

30. That's exactly right.

[AtheistCrusader]

36. That, and their magical ability to shelter church wealth from judgments.

[rug]

37. Oh, I'd say the banks and corporations have much stronger mojo than that.

[AtheistCrusader]

39. Depends on a LOT of things.

[cleanhippie]

8. All the ones responsible. Wouldn't you agree?

[rug]

12. Is that a verbatim talking point I see?

[Warren Stupidity]

6. You can prosecute them though.

Criminal prosecution of an entire Catholic archdiocese is rare, but not entirely unprecedented, in American courts.

An Ohio judge in 2003 convicted the Archdiocese of Cincinnati of failing to report sexually abusive priests in the 1970s and ’80s. The judge fined the archdiocese $10,000, the maximum allowed, after the archbishop entered a no-contest plea.

But the Minnesota allegations are especially stark because the sexual abuse is said to have occurred relatively recently, long after sexual misconduct by priests had been widely reported and after Catholic institutions implemented programs aimed at preventing further abuse.

“Naming the archdiocese as a corporation implicates the wrongdoing and the failure to protect children by all of the top officials, past and present,” Jeff Anderson, a lawyer in Minnesota who has represented clergy sex-abuse victims, said in a statement.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/06/us/catholic-archdiocese-in-minnesota-charged-over-sex-abuse-by-priest.html?_r=0

I guess Ramsey County prosecutor, John J. Choi should have consulted you first.

http://stmedia.startribune.com/documents/Archdiocese+of+Saint+Paul+and+Minneapolis+6.5.15.pdf

[rug]

13. I don't conslt with prosecutors.

Diversion aside, there's nothing there about incarcerating a corporation.

[Warren Stupidity]

15. Good point rug, so why did you bring it up?

[rug]

19. Because the OP is about prosecuting a corporation.

If you prefer uninformed bluster, don't let me stop you.

[Warren Stupidity]

22. yes rug, very good. See my previous post.

So you brought up incarceration simply to argue that you can't incarcerate a corporation. Excellent. You have scored a mighty blow against your own argument. Generally that is considered this:

[rug]

31. Your previous post hardly warrants two comments.

This one doesn't require one.

[Warren Stupidity]

35. And yet here you are commenting.

Odd.

[AtheistCrusader]

26. How does that make you feel, a church that is a corporation?

I know I've got funny feelings about it.

[rug]

32. How does it make you feel about American Atheists Inc.?

Last edited Sun Jun 7, 2015, 03:25 PM - Edit history (1)

Welcome to capitalist society, where everything, including thought, is a commodity.

[AtheistCrusader]

38. I like mixed market economies.

Being able to sell good ideas has kept me in scotch and scones my entire adult life, so, I feel pretty good about it.

The RCC must too, since it's become the wealthiest private entity on the planet. I could live quite well off a rounding error in their yearly budget.

[rug]

40. What's its percentage of charitable expenditres versus revenue?

[AtheistCrusader]

41. Nobody really knows. Too many shell games in motion.

The actual wealth of the RCC is, generally, considered impossible to account. I hear they're working on finance transparency though.

(Heh)

[AtheistCrusader]

27. Actually, corporate officers CAN be charged as well.

Prosecutors office ain't done yet.

[rug]

33. Which is the next thread.

[AtheistCrusader]

25. Not yet. Still a work in progress.

If Iceland can do it, we can too.

[Angry Dragon]

9. I am sick and tired of all the cover-ups