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cleanhippie

(19,705 posts)
Wed Jul 29, 2015, 10:17 AM Jul 2015

Rusty Houser hated women. He learned that at church.

--snip--

Houser’s violence was not abstract. He set out to kill women in the audience for an Amy Schumer movie. His lethal violence was an expression of his contempt for and distrust of women.

And that misogyny cannot be abstracted or diagnosed away from the anti-woman ideology he learned in his community, his culture, and, yes, in his church.

I’m not talking about his Southern Baptist church’s opposition to women’s ordination or its blasphemous “complementarian” theology of male supremacy, although that’s also part of it. But it’s possible to remain a Southern Baptist in mostly good standing while somewhat questioning that official required “stance” on the role of women in the church or the role of wives in marriage.

I’m talking about the more fundamental teaching — the paramount religious and ethical teaching of that denomination, which says that women cannot and must not be trusted. Rusty Houser was shaped by a faith tradition that does not abide any question or challenge to its official required stance of legal and political opposition to abortion.

Rusty Houser was shaped by a politicized religious community that routinely compares American women to Nazis and accuses them of killing “unborn babies” and thus being to blame for 9/11. Women, this central principle insists, cannot be trusted with their own sexuality or their own bodies. This is the fundamental fact it teaches about women: they are untrustworthy and irresponsible and morally inferior.

Houser embraced the premise of that teaching and — like Paul Hill and Scott Roeder — he took it all to heart. Now, as with Hill and Roeder, his actions are being dismissed as an aberration — the consequences of his mental illness rather than the consequences of the ideology instructed and required by his church.

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/slacktivist/2015/07/27/rusty-houser-hated-women-he-learned-that-at-church/



38 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Rusty Houser hated women. He learned that at church. (Original Post) cleanhippie Jul 2015 OP
Yes, the more strident apologists here skepticscott Jul 2015 #1
A look back into the life of John 'Rusty' Houser struggle4progress Jul 2015 #2
Lafayette shooter had history of right-wing web postings, erratic behavior struggle4progress Jul 2015 #3
Lafayette shooting: Gunman ID'd as "kind of a drifter" struggle4progress Jul 2015 #4
I am really quite sick of your ablist bullshit. Act_of_Reparation Jul 2015 #6
Perhaps you could benefit from a reading comprehension course: I simply posted struggle4progress Jul 2015 #7
Spare us the disingenuous innocence routine. Act_of_Reparation Jul 2015 #8
I think that when all one has to offer is a continual Google Gish Gallop, dignity is the least cleanhippie Jul 2015 #24
Lafayette Shooting Adds Another Angry Face in the Gunmen’s Gallery struggle4progress Jul 2015 #5
It is google gish gallop day here in the religion forum. Warren Stupidity Jul 2015 #9
I wonder if the dishonesty ever actually tweaks their conscience Promethean Jul 2015 #11
Cognitive Dissonance - mr blur Jul 2015 #12
There are no facts in the OP, only suppositions galore. kwassa Jul 2015 #15
Some chronology struggle4progress Jul 2015 #10
How long has he been a member of the baptist church? Lordquinton Jul 2015 #13
So might fucked up brain chemistry. Leontius Jul 2015 #18
Impeccable diagnosis, Dr. Rogers. Act_of_Reparation Jul 2015 #19
You also can't find religious belief as a mental disorder in there either but Leontius Jul 2015 #20
Please show me where I have said anything of the sort. Act_of_Reparation Jul 2015 #22
DSM-V, "religious and spiritual problems" AtheistCrusader Jul 2015 #23
You're awfully quiet, Leo. Here, let me help you out. Act_of_Reparation Aug 2015 #25
You're wasting your time. Leo doesn't respond when busted fabricating reality. cleanhippie Aug 2015 #27
Or if the response warrants more than one or two sentences. Act_of_Reparation Aug 2015 #28
"But it’s possible to remain a Southern Baptist in mostly good standing while somewhat questioning" Lordquinton Jul 2015 #14
Exhibit A: “The Mansplainingest Mansplainer Who Ever Internetted.” muriel_volestrangler Jul 2015 #16
And, what does this prove in relation to Houser? kwassa Jul 2015 #17
Fred posted it as an example of the Southern Baptist attitude to women (nt) muriel_volestrangler Jul 2015 #21
I don't know what he learned at church but I know what he DIDN'T learn from Jesus Nuclear Unicorn Aug 2015 #26
Some adherents to Abrahamic religions have a warped interpretation of the original sin Major Nikon Aug 2015 #29
So what's the non warped version? Lordquinton Aug 2015 #30
Well, less warped version(s) anyway Major Nikon Aug 2015 #33
I don't think original sin can be made to not be warped Lordquinton Aug 2015 #34
It's an ethical basis Major Nikon Aug 2015 #36
Who was Rusty Houser, the alleged Louisiana movie theater gunman? struggle4progress Aug 2015 #31
Thanks for proving out skepticscott Aug 2015 #32
It's strange, isn't it? Here's a guy who shot a bunch of strangers. And then some people struggle4progress Aug 2015 #37
No one is trying to explain all those other things skepticscott Aug 2015 #38
So where's your links about mental illness and violence? Lordquinton Aug 2015 #35
 

skepticscott

(13,029 posts)
1. Yes, the more strident apologists here
Wed Jul 29, 2015, 11:20 AM
Jul 2015

are constantly harping in the "this had NOTHING to do with religion, it's all about mental illness" meme every time a case like this makes the news, and it's really disgusting.

Something all of them should read:http://www.salon.com/2015/06/18/its_not_about_mental_illness_the_big_lie_that_always_follows_mass_shootings_by_white_males/

The core idea is this: “mental illness” never created any idea, motivation or belief system. “Mental illness” refers to the way our minds can distort the ideas we get from the world, but the ideas still come from somewhere.

struggle4progress

(118,701 posts)
2. A look back into the life of John 'Rusty' Houser
Wed Jul 29, 2015, 11:45 AM
Jul 2015

Posted: Jul 25, 2015 6:29 PM EDT
Updated: Jul 25, 2015 6:55 PM EDT
By Irisha Jones

... John Houser graduated from Columbus High School in 1973 before moving on Columbus State University then known as Columbus College and earning an accounting degree.

He was later diagnosed with mental illness. He spent time in a Columbus hospital and the East Alabama Mental Health Center. According to court documents from Carroll County, he posed a danger to himself and others.

He was arrested for arson in Columbus about 25 years ago also for theft in 1999 and convicted of selling alcohol to minors connected to his business in LaGrange. In Russell County, he was also denied a permit for a concealed carry weapon in 2006 because of the domestic violence report filed by his wife and the arson arrest in Columbus ...

Columbus Police Department arrest records show that Houser was arrested for theft by taking for stealing his opponents campaign signs while he was running for tax commissioner is 1996 ...


http://www.wtvm.com/story/29632539/a-look-back-into-the-life-of-john-rusty-houser

struggle4progress

(118,701 posts)
3. Lafayette shooter had history of right-wing web postings, erratic behavior
Wed Jul 29, 2015, 11:47 AM
Jul 2015

By Ralph Ellis, Michael Pearson and Ed Payne, CNN
Updated 12:55 PM ET, Mon July 27, 2015

... He left a trail of erratic behavior.

His last known major legal problem came last year when he was evicted from the house he owned in Phenix City. Heath Taylor, sheriff of Russell County, said Houser returned to the house and vandalized it by pouring concrete down the plumbing and tampering with the natural gas lines, including the one that ran to a fireplace inside.

"If you'd turned it on it would have blown [flames] out," Taylor said.

He was arrested on arson charges in the 1980s when he was accused of hiring a man to set fire to office of a lawyer who represented pornographic movie theaters, according to the Ledger-Enquirer newspaper in Columbus ...


http://www.cnn.com/2015/07/24/us/louisiana-theater-shooter/

struggle4progress

(118,701 posts)
4. Lafayette shooting: Gunman ID'd as "kind of a drifter"
Wed Jul 29, 2015, 11:51 AM
Jul 2015

CBS/AP July 24, 2015, 8:42 AM
Last Updated Jul 24, 2015 6:54 PM EDT

... Formerly a resident of Phenix City, Ala., Houser had been staying since early July at a local motel, Lafayette Police Chief Jim Craft said. It was there that, following last night's shooting at the Grand 16 theater, investigators found wigs, glasses and disguises.

In 2008 Houser's wife and other family members asked for a temporary protective order against him. Court documents said Houser "exhibited extreme erratic behavior and has made ominous as well as disturbing statements" ...

Houser "has a history of mental health issues, i.e., manic depression and/or bi-polar disorder" the filing said. The documents also state that Houser's wife, Kellie Maddox Houser, became "so worried about the defendant's volatile mental state that she has removed all guns and/or weapons from their marital residence" ...

In March Kellie filed for divorce ...


http://www.cbsnews.com/news/lafayette-shooting-gunman-identified-as-john-russell-houser/

Act_of_Reparation

(9,116 posts)
6. I am really quite sick of your ablist bullshit.
Wed Jul 29, 2015, 12:48 PM
Jul 2015

"Depression and bipolar disorder" do not explain violent behavior. Would you kindly stop stigmatizing people who suffer from these afflictions?

Our lives are difficult enough without people like you constantly hanging shit like this around our necks.

struggle4progress

(118,701 posts)
7. Perhaps you could benefit from a reading comprehension course: I simply posted
Wed Jul 29, 2015, 12:53 PM
Jul 2015

an excerpt from a news story about Houser, and the text you dislike summarizes the content of a 2008 protective order

Act_of_Reparation

(9,116 posts)
8. Spare us the disingenuous innocence routine.
Wed Jul 29, 2015, 01:22 PM
Jul 2015

Anyone even passingly familiar with your antics knows well what you're trying to achieve here.

You didn't post that story because you felt it would make for interesting reading. You posted it because you feel it satisfactorily contradicts the OP's claim that Houser's religion played a role in his violent behavior, that "manic depression and/or bipolar disorder" (which, incidentally, are the same fucking thing... so much for the authority of your beloved protective order) is itself a perfectly acceptable explanation for his murderous rampage.

But hey, that's alright. Don't let my dignity -- or the dignity of millions of other Americans living with neurochemical imbalances -- get in the way of your agenda.



cleanhippie

(19,705 posts)
24. I think that when all one has to offer is a continual Google Gish Gallop, dignity is the least
Thu Jul 30, 2015, 02:27 PM
Jul 2015

of their concern.

struggle4progress

(118,701 posts)
5. Lafayette Shooting Adds Another Angry Face in the Gunmen’s Gallery
Wed Jul 29, 2015, 11:55 AM
Jul 2015

By CAMPBELL ROBERTSON, RICHARD PÉREZ-PEÑA and ALAN BLINDER
JULY 24, 2015

... Accounts from acquaintances, law enforcement officials and court records portrayed Mr. Houser, 59, of Phenix City, Ala., who also took his own life, as a man with a diffuse collection of troubles and grievances — personal, political and social — who had a particular anger for women, liberals, the government and a changing world.

Because he had been accused of both domestic violence and soliciting arson, though never successfully prosecuted, he was denied a permit to carry a concealed pistol. His family repeatedly described him as violent and mentally ill; his mental health had been called into question going back decades, and he spent time in a hospital receiving psychiatric care. He vandalized the house he was evicted from last year, and tampered with the gas lines in a way that could have caused a fire or explosion.

Given his history, he should not have been allowed to own a gun, said Sheriff Heath D. Taylor of Russell County, where Mr. Houser lived ...


http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/25/us/lafayette-theater-shooting-john-houser.html?_r=0

 

Warren Stupidity

(48,181 posts)
9. It is google gish gallop day here in the religion forum.
Wed Jul 29, 2015, 02:47 PM
Jul 2015

Somebody is upset about the bad news for religion. Again.

Promethean

(468 posts)
11. I wonder if the dishonesty ever actually tweaks their conscience
Wed Jul 29, 2015, 04:38 PM
Jul 2015

or if it has been completely buried under obedience to their sky tyrant.

kwassa

(23,340 posts)
15. There are no facts in the OP, only suppositions galore.
Wed Jul 29, 2015, 06:30 PM
Jul 2015

Houser could have learned his misogyny from many different sources. Unless this author has evidence, he has nothing.

struggle4progress

(118,701 posts)
10. Some chronology
Wed Jul 29, 2015, 03:11 PM
Jul 2015

1981: speeding charge
1988: earns accounting degree from Columbus State
1988/9?: arrested for criminal solicitation of arson in Columbus; charge not pursued
1994: enrolled in unaccredited law program at Faulkner University
1996: pleaded guilty to speeding
1996: arrested for stealing local election campaign signs
1997: pleaded guilty to speeding
1998: graduated Faulkner University
1998: runs for tax commissioner; drops out of race
1998-2001: operated Rusty's Buckhead Pub
2001: Pub shut down for serving minors; hangs swastika in protest
2002: filed for bankruptcy
2004: filed suit in plasma donation case; settled
2005: subject of domestic violent complaint; charge not pursued
2005: registers with David Duke's European-American Unity and Rights Organization
2006: concealed carry permit denied
2007: reported vehicle stolen; recovered by police
2008: wife reports him to police as "mentally disturbed"
2008/9: mental health treatment
2013: separation from wife
2014: refused to move out of house; evicted; left buckets of feces; splattered paint, poured concrete down drains, set gasoline “booby-traps”
2014: posts on neo-Nazi website
2015: wife obtains divorce

http://www.ontopmag.com/article.aspx?id=21273&MediaType=1&Category=26
http://www.al.com/news/index.ssf/2015/07/john_russell_houser_known_as_r.html
http://www.fox10tv.com/story/29644163/john-houser-stole-campaign-signs-arrested-in-1996
http://www.wvtm13.com/news/john-houser-remembered-as-watchdog-in-georgia-hometown/34341766
http://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com/story/news/crime/2015/07/24/la-theater-shooter-idd--man--phenix-city/30612149/
http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/lafayette-theater-shooting/louisiana-theater-shooting-gunman-john-houser-disturbed-family-said-docs-n397726
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3173524/America-financially-failing-filth-farm-Tea-Party-member-Westboro-Baptist-supporter-opened-fire-Louisiana-movie-theater-killing-2-injuring-9-s-revealed-wife-tried-hide-guns-him.html

Lordquinton

(7,886 posts)
13. How long has he been a member of the baptist church?
Wed Jul 29, 2015, 06:25 PM
Jul 2015

Being spoonfed hate might have had an influence. And nice starting it off wi a speeding ticket, reveals much about your bias.

Act_of_Reparation

(9,116 posts)
19. Impeccable diagnosis, Dr. Rogers.
Wed Jul 29, 2015, 11:23 PM
Jul 2015

But it's strange. I can't find "fucked up brain chemistry" anywhere in my copy of the DSM. Perhaps it's outdated.

 

Leontius

(2,270 posts)
20. You also can't find religious belief as a mental disorder in there either but
Thu Jul 30, 2015, 01:34 AM
Jul 2015

you spout that fucking puke all the time.

Act_of_Reparation

(9,116 posts)
22. Please show me where I have said anything of the sort.
Thu Jul 30, 2015, 09:25 AM
Jul 2015


Meanwhile, I'll get the ICD-10 folks on the line. You could make the case for renaming paraplegia "fucked up spine syndrome".

Act_of_Reparation

(9,116 posts)
25. You're awfully quiet, Leo. Here, let me help you out.
Tue Aug 4, 2015, 09:17 AM
Aug 2015

Some instructive examples:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1218&pid=126398


Don't get me wrong. I make no quarrels about my anti-theism, and I do think religious upbringing plays a role in the development of religious delusion; but I've been trained in the behavioral sciences. While not a clinician myself (social psych is my area of expertise), I've seen enough cases of psychosis to tell the difference between a mentally ill person, and person who believes stupid shit.


http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1218&pid=126406

Within the RCC, belief in the existence demons is not only normative, but taught as incontrovertible fact by people who have been invested (undeservedly, of course) with enormous authority. They're stupid, yes, but not mentally ill.


http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1218&pid=78330

I also happen to believe religious belief, generally speaking, does not satisfactorily meet the definition of "delusion".


There, hope that hel...

Oh...

Wait...

Those are examples me saying precisely the opposite of that fucking puke I apparently spout "all the time". Whoopsie!



cleanhippie

(19,705 posts)
27. You're wasting your time. Leo doesn't respond when busted fabricating reality.
Fri Aug 7, 2015, 01:03 PM
Aug 2015

Which seems to be much of the time.

Lordquinton

(7,886 posts)
14. "But it’s possible to remain a Southern Baptist in mostly good standing while somewhat questioning"
Wed Jul 29, 2015, 06:27 PM
Jul 2015

But it’s possible to remain a Southern Baptist in mostly good standing while somewhat questioning that official required “stance” on the role of women in the church or the role of wives in marriage.

This is important. They don't care if you don't 100% tow the line, as long as you're a member. The structure is still rooted in hate ready to pour out at the first convenience.

Look at all these good Christian cops murdering black people wi no remorse.

muriel_volestrangler

(101,759 posts)
16. Exhibit A: “The Mansplainingest Mansplainer Who Ever Internetted.”
Wed Jul 29, 2015, 07:49 PM
Jul 2015
Q: So, yesterday, Fred, you made a sweeping claim about white evangelicalism — saying it has been wholly supplanted by a religion of anti-abortionism in which all its former Christian doctrines have been reduced to mere accompaniments of a new, paramount dogma teaching that women are untrustworthy, irresponsible, and morally incapable. Can you provide any evidence to support this assertion?

A: Allow me to introduce Exhibit A: “The Mansplainingest Mansplainer Who Ever Internetted.”

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/slacktivist/2015/07/28/count-your-ribs-and-say-your-prayers-and-go-to-sleep/

(Jonathan Merritt is a Southern Baptist writer on religion, whose father was the Southern Baptist Conference President from 2000-2002)

Major Nikon

(36,868 posts)
29. Some adherents to Abrahamic religions have a warped interpretation of the original sin
Sun Aug 9, 2015, 01:48 AM
Aug 2015

With the idea being Eve led Adam down the path of temptation, so therefore women are tools of the devil used to lead men astray.

Major Nikon

(36,868 posts)
33. Well, less warped version(s) anyway
Sun Aug 9, 2015, 12:18 PM
Aug 2015

If you take out the hocus pocus, the concept does offer at least some philosophical value albeit small compared to other similar philosophical ideas that are already void of hocus pocus.

Lordquinton

(7,886 posts)
34. I don't think original sin can be made to not be warped
Sun Aug 9, 2015, 02:15 PM
Aug 2015

Even if you don't have it rest on women's shoulders it's a pretty terrible concept.

Major Nikon

(36,868 posts)
36. It's an ethical basis
Sun Aug 9, 2015, 02:38 PM
Aug 2015

Just not a very good one. With or preferably without religion, society still needs some kind of thought process which defines one's moral duty.

struggle4progress

(118,701 posts)
31. Who was Rusty Houser, the alleged Louisiana movie theater gunman?
Sun Aug 9, 2015, 07:21 AM
Aug 2015

JULY 24, 2015
BY STEPHANIE PEDERSEN
Columbus (Georgia) Ledger-Enquirer

... Among Houser’s legal issues was his trying in the 1980s to hire a man to set fire to the law office of John Swearingen ... “He’s always been strange,” Swearingen said, adding that no one else in the family seemed to share that eccentricity: “I liked his family and respected his family” ... According to the Associated Press, 2008 court records show Houser’s immediate family sought protective orders because he “exhibited extreme erratic behavior and has made ominous as well as disturbing statements” ... It said wife Kellie Maddox Houser “has become so worried about the defendant’s volatile mental state that she has removed all guns and/or weapons from their marital residence” ... Russell County Sheriff Heath Taylor told the Ledger-Enquirer that Houser in 2006 was denied a pistol permit ...

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/nation-world/national/article28502206.html

struggle4progress

(118,701 posts)
37. It's strange, isn't it? Here's a guy who shot a bunch of strangers. And then some people
Sun Aug 9, 2015, 02:47 PM
Aug 2015

want to point out that he tried to hire somebody to commit an arson, that his family tried to get a protective order against him, that his wife decided it would be smart to hide all his guns, that he once hung a swastika on a building, and that he tried to booby trap a home he rented -- when the only explanation really needed is that he had sometimes attended a Baptist church!

 

skepticscott

(13,029 posts)
38. No one is trying to explain all those other things
Sun Aug 9, 2015, 02:55 PM
Aug 2015

by saying that he attended a Baptist church. The OP is very specific about what it is attributing to his religious indoctrination, as anyone who'd actually read it would know, and it's not any of the things you mentioned.

Try again.

Lordquinton

(7,886 posts)
35. So where's your links about mental illness and violence?
Sun Aug 9, 2015, 02:16 PM
Aug 2015

You come back with this over a week later, but nothing to back up your claims.

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