The Vatican Finds it to be "Impossible" for Transgendered People to be Godparents

[Goblinmonger]

Alex Salinas, a practicing Spanish Catholic, was “thrilled and honored” when his sister asked him to be his nephew’s godfather. As required under Catholic law, he sought permission from his local church to assume the role. The process was halted, however, due to what the priest considered to be Salinas’s inability to “live in accordance with the faith.” The reason? Salinas is transgender.

Salinas, saying that the priest’s decision felt like a “kick in the stomach,” appealed to the bishop of the Dioceses of Cádiz and Ceuta. The bishop overturned the priest’s decision. However, citing “confusion among some of the faithful” and the heavy media attention, the bishop wrote to the Vatican’s Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith for guidance.

Although the Vatican does not have an official position on transgendered people, it responded to the bishop’s inquiry by stating that it is “impossible” for transgendered persons to fulfill their duties as godparents because they are not seen by the Catholic church as consistently living the Church’s teachings.

Specifically, the Vatican stated that transsexual behavior “reveals in a public way an attitude opposite to the moral imperative of solving the problem of sexual identity according to the truth of one’s own sexuality.” It continued that “it is evident that [a transgendered person] does not possess the requirement of leading a life according to the faith and in the position of godfather and is therefore unable to be admitted to the position of godfather or godmother.”

Full Article

Though it kind of reads like I changed the headline, I didn't.

Can we please get to the point where we just full on acknowledge the bigotry of the RCC?

One of my favorite comments form the comment section is "I'm no catholic, i hate religion, but look, if you are going to be part of a cult with a lot of arbitrary rules about how you should live, expect that some of these rules will be ARBITRARY."

[cleanhippie]

1. I'm sure someone will be along soon to Catho-splain this as just a technicality.

That somehow it doesn't really mean what it means.


Or something.

[trotsky]

3. Yes, I'm sure that no one involved is bigoted in any way.

They just have to say that because, well, uhh, because reasons.

[immoderate]

2. Look. Bullshit is created. It's not natural.

There must be someone to make this shit up. Is that clear?

--imm

[Cartoonist]

4. I have no sympathy for these people

If you join a Klan, you have to abide by the rules.
If you don't like the rules, leave the Klan.
That's what I did, and I've never looked back.

On edition: I meant to respond to the OP, not immoderate.

[beam me up scottie]

5. But the homophobes in the Vatican aren't bigots, Kim Davis is but that's because DU hates her.

The pope just defended and met with her because ... I forget, what was the latest excuse offered up by the apologists?

[trotsky]

7. He was tricked! It was a setup!

The EVC (Evil Vatican Conspiracy) is out to get him!

[edhopper]

6. If I have ever seen clear hate speech

that is it.

[trotsky]

8. I find it "impossible" to give the Vatican any moral credibility whatsoever. n/t

[Lordquinton]

9. I hope no one plays the Pope card on this one

Cause he thinks thatGender Theory is akin to a nuclear bomb, capable of annihilating millions of people at once!

[LostOne4Ever]

10. As if Transpeople didn't have enough shit to put up with. nt

[rug]

11. Do you know every link in that article is at least a month old?

http://www.thenewcivilrightsmovement.com/uncucumbered/vatican_intervenes_to_prevent_trans_man_from_being_a_godfather

http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/vatican-says-no-to-transsexual-godparents-amid-spain-controversy-54280/

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/01/27/pope-francis-reportedly-met-with-a-transgender-man-at-the-vatican/

http://www.advocate.com/transgender/2015/09/03/vatican-impossible-trans-people-be-godparents

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/vatican-says-transgender-man-cannot-become-a-godparent_55e9d869e4b002d5c075eeea

http://time.com/3975630/pope-francis-lgbt-issues/

http://www.cruxnow.com/church/2015/09/02/vatican-backs-spanish-bishop-in-vetoing-transgender-man-as-a-godfather/

It was even posted here.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1218211478

You need to fine tune your Google alerts.

[Goblinmonger]

12. So you've had all that time and still nothing to say.

Oh well.

My bad for not remembering Warren had posted it.

[rug]

13. There's never a dearth of Catholic-bashing in here. You should check for duplicates.

[Goblinmonger]

14. What about the article isn't true?

I think the truth is the absolute defense to slander/libel. There's not even any spin in there. It's stating the church's position. Unless that isn't the position. If so, please do enlighten.

[rug]

15. The third link, from the Washington Post, gives some insight.

I note three things:

1) The RCC has no specific policy about persons who are transgendered .

2) The Pope is not personally transphobic.

3) The institiutional Church is likely controlled by prelates who are personally transphobic.

The entire issue deserves better than a Daily Mail treatment.

[AlbertCat]

16. 3) The institiutional Church is likely controlled by prelates who are personally transphobic.

So the church IS bigoted .... and the Pope is just a poor put upon victim of those meanie bishops!

[rug]

17. You are a poor translator, Albert.

However, the comment you wrote reminds me of what people have posted about Obama and the "meanie" republicans.

[Goblinmonger]

19. Oh

1) So the bigotry is just institutionalized and not policy based. That make it SO much better.

2) How the hell do you know? When did you have that conversation with him?

3) The RCC is controlled by the Pope. If he wanted to make it so that transgender people could be godparents, he could make that happen.

[rug]

20. Tsk.

1) Yes. Show me the contrary policy.

2) How the hell do YOU know he's transphobic.

3) Laughably wrong. You really don't understand the density of this institution, do you?

[Cartoonist]

36. So the Pope is just a figurehead.

He has absolutely no power to change anything.

Suppose Frank spoke up one day and said, "From now on, the church will follow the teachings of Jesus and love one another. We will accept gays as children of God and accord them full and equal status."

Would they hang him or fall in line?

[rug]

37. There is as much a gap between that statement and this statement

The RCC is controlled by the Pope. If he wanted to make it so that transgender people could be godparents, he could make that happen.

as there is between a republican's ears.

Do you enjoy thinking in black and white terms?

Meanwhile, the RCC Catechism, if you cared to look, answers your question.

They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided.

[Cartoonist]

38. So the Pope is a nope.

Obama can sign an executive order allowing gays to serve in the military, but the Pope can't do shit.

Pathetic.

[rug]

39. No, the Pope is the 78 year old current occupant of a huge institution.

I'll throw you a tape measure if you want to measure the gap between that and your statement.

[Cartoonist]

40. Occupant?

I keep getting his mail.

Thank you for clarifying that he's a powerless old fart

[rug]

41. I tried.

Too bad it didn't take.

[cleanhippie]

18. It's not that it's untrue, you just need to have it catho-sprlained to you.

And it looks like someone has done just that.

You see, technically the RCC isn't transphobic...

[rug]

21. You remind me of the fourth member of the chorus of a failed comedy by Aristophanes.

[cleanhippie]

23. !

[Bradical79]

22. The Vatican is run by bigots

I'm shocked

[Iggo]

24. I think me and the catholic church are working from different understandings of the word impossible.

[mr blur]

25. Rational humans find it "Impossible" for a 78-year-old misanthropic virgin

to claim that he has any moral authority, experience or insight into who or why people should marry, what they should do in bed and who they should do it with and whether or not they have, or bring up, children.

[SheilaT]

26. I was raised Roman Catholic in this country,

and I am not aware of any requirement to seek permission from the Church to be a godparent. I realize the custom may be quite different in a largely Catholic country, but needing permission is b.s. "Catholic law" is equal nonsense, which is why we try to have separation of church and state in this country, even though a lot of people don't quite get it.

[Goblinmonger]

27. Well, you kind of do.

If you aren't Catholic, you can't be a Godparent. Well, maybe if there is another one that is and the priest looks the other way. But you need to be Catholic. And the RCC stance on gender theory means that you aren't a Catholic if you are transgender. So that is why it is "impossible" for that person to be a GodpARENT.

Serious question: If you think that Catholic law is "nonsense," why are you still a Catholic? there are plenty of Episcopalian churches that are far more liberal an in line with what you believe and you will hardly notice the difference in the mass.

[trotsky]

28. It's similar to the defense launched by those trying to get the RCC off the hook for many things.

Why is the RCC so opposed to homosexuality? "No no you guys, you've got it all wrong. They're totally NOT homophobic. See, the church is opposed to ANY sex outside of marriage. What's that you say? The church doesn't provide an option for homosexuals to get married? Well, who woulda figured? Gosh, funny how that works. But you see, that proves it's really not about gay folks at all, just the sanctity of straight marriage! Are you able to swallow this bullshit yet? Shall I keep going? What about if I simply proclaim that the RCC shouldn't wade into politics, despite the fact that THEY'VE ALWAYS DONE THAT AND WILL ALWAYS CONTINUE TO? Can we talk about what a dick Richard Dawkins is now? He tweeted something dumb! PULEEEEZEE can we pile on Dawkins?!?"

[rug]

30. Are you having a hard day, trotsky?

You sound angry.

[rug]

29. A nonCatholic Christian can be a witness to a Catholic baptism along with a Catholic godparent.

The RCC does not say a transgendered person can not be a Catholic, no matter what kind of gender theory you think it espouses.

[Goblinmonger]

31. Yeah, they can be a "witness" as long as a Catholic is a godparent.

That's what I said.

They aren't a Catholic in good standing. They have a mortal sin on their soul. They can't take the sacrament. They can't fulfill the law of the church that they take communion during Easter. So, sure, whatever you want to say to make yourself feel better, that's fine. And they can't be a godparent.

[rug]

34. Actually, you said they may.

Don't worry about what makes myself "feel better", just get the facts straight.

Why do you think anyone, including the RCC, considers the mere fact of being transgendered a mortal sin? That's not correct at all.

https://catholictrans.wordpress.com/2013/12/07/what-does-the-catholic-church-actually-say-about-transgenderism/

[SheilaT]

32. Oh, I'm not. I should have made that clear in my post.

I left the church in my teens, and over the years have come to the conclusion that basically all organized religion is a cult of some kind.

[Goblinmonger]

33. Likely my misunderstanding.

That makes WAY more sense.

[SheilaT]

35. Not at all. Maybe you could have inferred

from what I wrote that I'm long since no longer a Catholic, or belong to any organized religion of any sort, but I wouldn't expect you to.