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Wed Jun 8, 2016, 11:36 PM

 

Düsseldorf: migrants burn their shelter over observance of Ramadan

It would appear one group didn't wake up another on time for the first prayer of the day.
A sin apparently so great it called for the burning of a building.

Religion...

German Police Hold Two Men on Suspicion of Starting Shelter Fire

Police say Düsseldorf fire might be related to a dispute over the observation of Ramadan

BERLIN—Two residents at a refugee shelter in Düsseldorf are being held on suspicion of starting a fire that left the building in ruins this week, a city prosecutor said Wednesday.

The two 26-year-old men from North Africa were in police custody and waiting Wednesday night to face a judge, who would decide whether to prolong their incarceration with charges pending, a spokeswoman for the local police said.

The blaze that left the shelter, a former exhibition hall on the city’s trade fair grounds that was home to about 220 residents, a mess of ash and rubble likely started when a mattress was set on fire Tuesday, investigators said while cautioning their work was complex.

While it was too early to establish a motive for the suspected arson, police said it might be related to a simmering dispute in the shelter over the observation of the Muslim fasting month of Ramadan, which began Monday.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/german-police-hold-two-men-on-suspicion-of-starting-shelter-fire-1465407168

14 replies, 1241 views

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Response to Albertoo (Original post)

Thu Jun 9, 2016, 12:28 AM

1. A clear menace to society

That's what religion is.

The time has come for a summit between all nations to put an end to all this BS. Even if the fire was accidental and unrelated to religion, we can't go on with this tension due to make-believe nonsense.

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Response to Cartoonist (Reply #1)

Thu Jun 9, 2016, 02:50 AM

2. a summit between all nations to put an end to all this BS? 57 countries won't agree

 

The Islamic Conference has worked long and hard to get a universal ban on blasphemy

Defamation of religion and the United Nations
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamation_of_religion_and_the_United_Nations

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Response to Albertoo (Reply #2)

Thu Jun 9, 2016, 06:23 AM

4. This part makes no sense

In 2011, with falling support for the defamation of religion approach, the OIC changed their approach and introduced a new resolution on "Combating intolerance, negative stereotyping and stigmatization of, and discrimination, incitement to violence and violence against, persons based on religion or belief"


Wouldn't that end all laws against apostasy?


As for a summit, I don't necessarily expect agreement, I just want an open discussion at high levels to put an end to this BS, not some chatter in the U.N.

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Response to Cartoonist (Reply #4)

Thu Jun 9, 2016, 09:05 AM

5. They get round that by claiming public discussion of other religions is 'exploitation of ignorance'

Article 10 of the Declaration states: "Islam is the religion of unspoiled nature. It is prohibited to exercise any form of compulsion on man or to exploit his poverty or ignorance in order to convert him to another religion or to atheism."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cairo_Declaration_on_Human_Rights_in_Islam

That allows a government like Saudi Arabia to say that any public claim that any other religion is valid, or that atheism is valid, is an attempt to convert someone, and thus illegal.

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Response to Cartoonist (Reply #4)

Thu Jun 9, 2016, 09:07 PM

8. Do you think the OIC believes in its own 2011 resolution?

 

If so, one would expect a bit more resolute police response in Egypt, Pakistan, Bangladesh, when mobs lynch people on 'religious' grounds (atheists, gays, eloping maidens,..)

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Response to Albertoo (Original post)

Thu Jun 9, 2016, 03:11 AM

3. "it was too early to establish a motive"

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Response to struggle4progress (Reply #3)

Thu Jun 9, 2016, 09:10 PM

9. might be related to a dispute over the observation of Ramadan

 

In police terms, 'might' means very indication points to that so far.

If not, the police just won't comment.

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Response to Albertoo (Reply #9)

Thu Jun 9, 2016, 09:15 PM

10. ... "We had to do it, so that something changes" ... The fire was apparently set due to issues

with the lunch. The culprits, who reportedly don‘t observe the Muslim ritual of fasting during the month of Ramadan, had complained about the meager meal portions. The small portions appear to be the motive ...

German lawmaker calls for easier deportation
09.06.2016

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Response to struggle4progress (Reply #10)

Thu Jun 9, 2016, 09:28 PM

12. German sources confirm the cause of the trouble was religious

 

'Ramadan row' behind fire at Düsseldorf refugee shelter

http://www.thelocal.de/20160609/ramadan-row-behind-fire-at-dsseldorf-refugee-shelter

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Response to Albertoo (Reply #12)

Thu Jun 9, 2016, 09:35 PM

13. "... there was one group that wanted to strictly observe the fast, and another that insisted

on the usual timetables and usual servings ... This had led on several occasions to disputes and altercations with officials of the German Red Cross" ... from your link

This might, of course, be entirely consistent with what was in my link: namely, that several people (who perhaps didn't celebrate Ramadan) were upset with small portions

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Response to struggle4progress (Reply #13)

Thu Jun 9, 2016, 09:38 PM

14. That still makes the origin of the trouble religious

 

In short, people have been burning a real building over an incoherent, contradictory book full of factual mistakes which was team-written some 1400 years ago.

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Response to Albertoo (Reply #9)

Thu Jun 9, 2016, 09:17 PM

11. ... Three weeks earlier there were reports of a smaller fire at the centre as a migrant set fire

to his mattress in protest against the accommodation ...

Two arrested following $11m arson attack at Dusseldorf Messe
JUN 09, 2016
BY TOM HALL

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Response to Albertoo (Original post)

Thu Jun 9, 2016, 09:46 AM

6. Fasting and prayer are linked.

The morning prayer is at dawn.

Fasting begins at dawn, so the start of the prayer is pretty much the start of fasting. No food for you until the call for evening prayer.

Around Xmas, not such a big deal, even for worshipers of food. Short days. Cool days. But around the summer solstice, ugh. Those who really can't do without their rations, well, I can see how they'd be really POed.

(Day of Atonement, of course, is harder. Still, sometimes it's later and cooler and sometimes I've sweated without AC with temps in the upper 80s or low 90s for the sun to set.)

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Response to Albertoo (Original post)

Thu Jun 9, 2016, 09:48 AM

7. Bukhari (11:626)

The Prophet said, "No prayer is harder for the hypocrites than the Fajr and the 'Isha' prayers and if they knew the reward for these prayers at their respective times, they would certainly present themselves (in the mosques) even if they had to crawl." The Prophet added, "Certainly I decided to order the Mu'adh-dhin (call-maker) to pronounce Iqama and order a man to lead the prayer and then take a fire flame to burn all those who had not left their houses so far for the prayer along with their houses."


Sigh.

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