I'm sorry AmeriCANTS...

[Buddyblazon]

...but AmeriCANS understand that if you believe you can't...guess what...you are correct.

Made this thread a few weeks ago and was mocked. I'm sure I will be again.

But how awful is to go through life not being able to do stuff? I wouldn't know. Because "can't" isn't part of my vocabulary.

It's amazing that people cling to this type of
"can't do" attitude. How do people succeed in life with that attitude?

[Dem2]

1. Thanks for this uplifting message

Whoever these "can'ts" are, they really should be ashamed of their lack of 'can do' attitude.

[Buddyblazon]

2. It actually shocks me that most are not only...

NOT ashamed of their "can't do" attitude...

they cling to it and get angry when you point it out.

[rhett o rick]

23. They hide their fear of trying, fear of fighting for those struggling, behind what they call

pragmatism. Instead of fighting the bully, they want the bully (Big Money) to like them. And they rationalize away the damage done by the bully.

[Ferd Berfel]

3. The Neo-Democrats

have been arguing for:
GMO
Fracking
NAFTA
TPP
Monsanto

and against:
15/hr

and the wall street transaction tax et al ....

These are the arguments I've been having for years with my Republican friends.

[Skwmom]

4. Funny how that NEVER gets said to the 1%.

[Hoyt]

5. Sometimes you can, just not the way some folks think.

Like, I think you get to single payer, or something very close, with a public option. Now that heavy lifting is done with ACA, that's a relatively minor change. Going all out for single payer will get us a crummy GOPer voucher system or worse.

So maybe it should be, "we can if we don't screw up while GOPers control Congress."

[Romulox]

7. We're still waiting for NAFTA to be renegotiated. We'll hold our breath for the ACA "fixes".

[Hoyt]

9. It was, TPP. And it's a lot better for people in poor countries. Problem is

so many of Sanders' supporters are Nationalists and America First types that treat poor foreign workers like scabs.

[Romulox]

11. LOL. You are ridiculous!

[leftofcool]

70. Truth is sometimes ridiculous.

[Buddyblazon]

14. No...

We understand that when the oxygen mask falls from the overhead compartment...we put ours on first before helping others. You won't be able to help anyone if you die before you get the chance.

[Hoyt]

16. America First . . . . . . we taken more of our share of the world's wealth and

resources, to the point more than 80% of Americans are the world's 1%ers.

[Buddyblazon]

20. We get it...

you can't.

You've made that abudently clear.

You're welcome to make a thread for CANTers though.

[rhett o rick]

28. And so you recommend fixing that by making most of those 80% poorer and the top

1% (Clinton Family), richer and richer. The Free Trade Agreements isn't taking from the US 99% and helping out the rest of the world, but using it to make the rich, much richer

[Hoyt]

37. Ask a peasant in a poor country how much they'd like a decent job. Might not live up

to your standards, but it's a start for them. Again, treating them like scabs darn sure isn't helping.

[Buddyblazon]

55. There's starving children in Africa...

That's what they told me when we were kids.

[Hoyt]

58. And you think that is funny or something?

[Buddyblazon]

59. No.

I'm saying you sound like my mother. Lol

[rhett o rick]

26. Let me see if I got this correct. You are rationalizing Americans losing their jobs to

cheap labor abroad is justified because it helps the foreign workers. It has been proven that agreements like NAFTA only help the major corporations and not any workers.

None of the "Free" trade agreements have helped reduce the growing world wealth gap, in fact they contribute.

[Hoyt]

38. Yet every country lines up to sign agreements like NAFTA, TPP. Why, because the countries

need the investment, jobs, and tax revenue. As the world develops we'll all be better off long-term. No wonder they call us "greedy Americans."

[rhett o rick]

39. As the world develops is rhetoric. What does it mean. The world itself builds muscles.

NAFTA was sold as helping Mexican workers increase their standard of living which was going to make a market for American products. What a load of bullcrap. The Mexican workers didn't get any increase in their standard of living and Americans lost jobs. Your friends the greedy corporations took all the money.

You are preaching the propaganda of the Oligarchs. For the last 40 years the Oligarchy has tripled their wealth and the lower 99% have stagnated.

The greedy Americans are those that have been profiting by the wars, the destruction of our environment, and the rape of our economy. And you dare try to make us in the 99% feel like we are the greedy ones. Come down to our foodbank and explain how you want them to sacrifice to help workers in China.

[Hoyt]

46. Actually they did. Ask the Mexican workers who just got jobs at auto plants paying substantially

more per hour than ever before. And Mexico begged to be part of TPP and other trade agreements. They don't want to farm for 50 cents a day.

[Buddyblazon]

8. Yeah...

I've been told for several decades that incrementalism is the path. But they've been telling us that for awhile and gladly capitulating before negotiations even begin...and look where we are now.

Yeah...they've already proved they use incrementalism only because "I can't" is less acceptable.

[Hoyt]

12. Well thank God for incremebtalism in FDR's Social Security system which originally

excluded most women and Blacks.

[Buddyblazon]

15. So he went whole hog...

and THEN cleaned up the garbage. Thanks for proving my point.

Yours is an argument of people that "can't". It makes reasonable sense to you. But it keeps most from ever accomplishing anything significant.

[rhett o rick]

32. Hold on. FDR put in place a number of major programs to help people. These programs

were not incrementally introduced. And if you look around, the incremental changing going on is reducing our safety nets. Social Security has already been cut back and if Goldman-Sachs gets elected, watch for major cut backs.

Those in power want us peons to settle for incremental changes but when the banks overdrew their credit accounts, they demanded immediate compensation to the tune of 5 trillion dollars.

[Hoyt]

36. Sorry, the original SS was about like original Medicare. Without incremental change, neither

program would be of much use nowadays. Even Obama greatly improved Medicare. Point is, incremental change is good and we'd be screwed without it. Hope we have a lot more like Public Option added to ACA.

[rhett o rick]

40. The ACA was sold as the first step. And now the Oligarchs tell us the second step may

be generations away. Fuck incrementalization. People that are starving should be fed. People without health care should get health care today. If you had your way, we would still be incrementaling our freedom from the British.

[Hoyt]

43. Well, the oligarchs won't get their way on major improvements to ACA. Since over 40%

of voters are opposed to single payer, we might be a ways away. But a Public Option would get us close relatively quickly without having to force those 40% to change overnight.

[pat_k]

6. On "can't win, so don't fight" meme.

Just posted on the subject in another thread.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1810499

[Buddyblazon]

10. This is really a fight between...

The Cans and Cants.

[pat_k]

19. Yes.

And that has been at the core of almost every fight between those outside demanding that our leaders stand up and fight on principle, win or lose, and those inside the beltway sphincter hell bent on preemptive surrender.

Finding ways to counter this overarching meme is essential.

[Vincardog]

13. How do people succeed in life with that attitude? They can't and won't and they blame librlus for it

[jwirr]

18. Oh, Hillary does not accept that in her own life - that is just

the theme she uses when it comes to the rest of us.

[Buddyblazon]

22. Hint...

they generally don't.

[Tarc]

17. AmeriCAN/AmeriCANT

It's like a hybrid of Hallmark Channel smarminess and Tea Party jingoistic patriotism.

[Buddyblazon]

21. Behold...

A lone CANTer appeared.

[Tarc]

29. ho-hum

Wake me up when you have more substance than a memegenerator.net submission.

[insta8er]

45. Now we have seen your one liner, but try to argue the facts...

[Tarc]

47. There were no facts presented, so...

All that the OP has is saccharine-filled jingoism.

[insta8er]

48. Yeah...just cuddle back in your seat, watch Faux news and let Hillster sing you a sweet lullaby

don't forget to hit the "report" button!

[NCTraveler]

24. We can improve primary and secondary education in this country.

We can ensure all Americans have affordable healthcare. We can have a justice department willing to continue down a more aggressive path of looking into civil rights violations. We can work to limit our and other countries harmful emissions. We can continue to help more people in need overseas. We can make the wealthy pay more and give a break to the middle class while increasing social aid to millions. We can....

[stevenleser]

25. Not really. There is no can't. It's really a disagreement of "When". Everything we want will

eventually occur.

I make the rather obvious argument it won't happen in the next 6-8 years under a Republican House of Representatives.

Every argument against that involves magical thinking.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

27. You arent wrong, but lets be honest, Hillary is not gonna push as hard

as Bernie or a few others for stuff like not only not cutting Soc Sec but maybe making it even better for average people.

She isnt gonna kill it like GOP, no, but we have to be honest about this stuff.

And I wonder how hard she would fight for single payer, to be honest.

Wont keep me from voting for her if I have to, of course.

[Buddyblazon]

35. She will NOT fight for single payer...

Last edited Fri Apr 22, 2016, 11:32 PM - Edit history (1)

She's already said we can't. She's not going to push for free public education. She already said we can't. She's not going to argue for any of those things for which she has said we can't do.

Those are the things we need to aim for. So why would I want to someone who says we can't do it? That would be asinine.

"Well this person can't do any this stuff I feel is important...I think I'll vote for them."...

...said nobody ever.

[Buddyblazon]

33. I've never said that it must pass for me to be content...

I'm saying I want you guys to TRY. Please. At least try. If it doesn't pass then we can all see where the roadblocks are...where we need to work.

But CANT? It like floating around on a raft in the Sea of Mediocrity.

[rbrnmw]

50. Hillary has devoted her life to Universal Healthcare

[Squinch]

52. The childishness of this "can vs. can't" argument is amazing. It makes clear the absolute

black and white thinking of some Sanders supporters.

The fact is that it is not a matter of "can vs. can't." It's a matter of magical thinking vs. doing the actual work of governance. Their plans for all this "can" never included much more than a snap of the fingers and wish that something will come into being.

I don't think they are ever going to understand this. It's too bad, but like most of the points they are arguing to the death these days, it simply doesn't mater. They can continue to spout simplistic jingoes all they want, but they are irrelevant. That part of the process is over. Nothing they can say or do now can change that.

The only choice that is relevant now is this: will they move forward with us to participate in the general election, or will they be left behind fighting this battle they have already lost against an enemy that has moved on and doesn't care about their arguments?

[Buddyblazon]

54. Please point me to the part where ...

I said any of this is just going to magically happen. Because I don't recall saying that.

[stevenleser]

60. Well said. nt

[mcar]

63. This!

[Buddyblazon]

64. Canters..

Both steven and you.

Why don't you guys tell us what else you're incapable of.

[stevenleser]

65. We're capable of getting our candidate nominated. So there is that. nt

[Buddyblazon]

66. We got Dukakis, Mondale, and Kerry nominated too..

so there's that.

[seabeyond]

69. You betcha. Ah ha.

[ismnotwasm]

67. I agree

I have a number of issues with the arguments this primary, and the how of the way anything gets done is the driving force for all of them. I see criticisms with no logical pathway to solutions. Sometimes it's a rallying cry-- "End Citizens United"-- which is a great thing to get rid of, but it still takes a Supreme Court. This doesn't mean there aren't logical pathways, but expecting say, universal healthcare or even single payer to happen in, say the next four years is the height of "magical thinking".

[Sheepshank]

30. grow up...speaking in absolutes is always a losing proposition

[Warren DeMontague]

42. Always?

[Ino]

31. They call it "being realistic"

[Buddyblazon]

34. Well that's a milquetoast reason...

to aim for mediocre.

[Warren DeMontague]

41. Someone here called sanders "the camplainger" the other day. I guess that makes Hillary

"The Cantidate"

[Donald Ian Rankin]

44. Please go jump off a tall building.

Since you won't admit that you can't fly, I'm sure you'll be fine.

[notadmblnd]

51. Hillary and the AmeriCANT's

Sounds like a 50's do-wop group.

[Squinch]

57. Or a Disney movie with lots of talking mice.

[NorthCarolina]

53. "Can't do" is simply cover for "Won't do". nt

[Buddyblazon]

56. Ding ding ding....

A WINRAR IS YOU!

[oasis]

61. 48 month car payments and 30 year home mortgages: Can't Nation.

The average American brain is so wired into working toward long term goals, they have become devoid of any visionary power.

[LWolf]

62. Confucius:

He who who says he can and he who says he can’t are both usually right.

I have some students in the middle of an election for student body president. One of them in particular is running a Sanders-esque campaign; so much so that I'm sure he's been following the primaries.

He used this quote on some of his fliers and posters. It fits, doesn't it?