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Madam45for2923

(7,178 posts)
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 07:50 AM Sep 2016

Why Are There Any Liberals Supporting Gary Johnson?

He supports TPP.
He supports fracking.
He opposes any federal policies that would make college more affordable or reduce student debt. In fact, he wants to abolish student loans entirely.
He thinks Citizens United is great.
He doesn't want to raise the minimum wage. At all.
He favors a balanced-budget amendment and has previously suggested that he would slash federal spending 43 percent in order to balance the budget. This would require massive cuts to Social Security, Medicare, and social welfare programs of all kinds.
He opposes net neutrality.
He wants to increase the Social Security retirement age to 75 and he's open to privatization.
He opposes any kind of national health care and wants to repeal Obamacare.
He opposes practically all forms of gun control.
He opposes any kind of paid maternity or medical leave.
He supported the Keystone XL pipeline.
He opposes any government action to address climate change.
He wants to cut the corporate tax rate to zero.
He appears to believe that we should reduce financial regulation. All we need to do is allow big banks to fail and everything will be OK.
He wants to remove the Fed's mandate to maximize employment and has spoken favorably of returning to the gold standard.
He wants to block-grant Medicare and turn it over to the states.
He wants to repeal the 16th Amendment and eliminate the income tax, the payroll tax, and the estate tax. He would replace it with a 28 percent FairTax that exempts the poor. This is equivalent to a 39 percent sales tax, and it would almost certainly represent a large tax cut for the rich.

. . . more: [link:http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2016/09/why-are-there-any-liberals-supporting-gary-johnson|

39 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Why Are There Any Liberals Supporting Gary Johnson? (Original Post) Madam45for2923 Sep 2016 OP
Some people only care about legalized marijuana yet mucifer Sep 2016 #1
This is true. bmstee01 Sep 2016 #26
A sucker is born every minute Politicub Sep 2016 #2
Some ignorant people can't think beyond "legalize it!" BobbyDrake Sep 2016 #3
No, if you support Gary Johnson you are not liberal. Demsrule86 Sep 2016 #4
Because he's positioning himself as an "independent," and there are lots of independents these days. pnwmom Sep 2016 #5
Agreed. TwilightZone Sep 2016 #23
They're poseurs and naifs, not liberals nt geek tragedy Sep 2016 #6
A vote for stein or Johnson is a vote for trump Gothmog Sep 2016 #7
The far left is not "sorta like liberals but just more so." Hortensis Sep 2016 #8
He has a penis. sarae Sep 2016 #9
Yup. Agschmid Sep 2016 #10
Exactly. athena Sep 2016 #15
Yep. You nailed it. skylucy Sep 2016 #27
So, Johnson's johnson is the reason? MineralMan Sep 2016 #35
Maybe the believed it when they were told... vi5 Sep 2016 #11
In other words, they can't think for themselves. athena Sep 2016 #14
Then what do you care? vi5 Sep 2016 #17
Even if you dont care it's still good to know! To know where people are REALLY coming from! Madam45for2923 Sep 2016 #21
I suppose carrying the "inevitable" meme so long after its best-used-by date can be monotonous LanternWaste Sep 2016 #25
That aspect has been covered in numerous replies already. NCTraveler Sep 2016 #22
So it's out of spite as well as lack of principles? Sounds like you empathize with them. I can't. bettyellen Sep 2016 #24
I don't agree with them but I do empathize with them. vi5 Sep 2016 #30
yes, i am sure someone else is responsible for their actions. La Lioness Priyanka Sep 2016 #32
Trust me, I don't.... vi5 Sep 2016 #33
They can't stand either Clinton or Trump. TheCowsCameHome Sep 2016 #12
When Johnson's name is mentioned on the news, saltpoint Sep 2016 #13
There are liberals supporting Johnson? Wednesdays Sep 2016 #16
Because Hillary Clinton doesn't have a penis nt jcgoldie Sep 2016 #18
I'm convinced that the whole Johnson pulls from Clinton is a myth... Wounded Bear Sep 2016 #19
Exactly...this is all pre-emptive scapegoating. vi5 Sep 2016 #31
Two different polls I've seen have shown 18 - 34 yr olds pulled to Johns in a big way.. beating uponit7771 Sep 2016 #36
One could make the argument they are the same PUMA 'Liberals' that supported McCain Brother Buzz Sep 2016 #20
A Libertarian Freddie Sep 2016 #28
because he gets the best weed Snake Plissken Sep 2016 #29
There aren't any liberals supporting Johnson. MineralMan Sep 2016 #34
One of my friends is democrattotheend Sep 2016 #38
They hate the two party system more than anything else on your list. davidn3600 Sep 2016 #37
He smokes pot. Iggo Sep 2016 #39

mucifer

(23,478 posts)
1. Some people only care about legalized marijuana yet
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 08:00 AM
Sep 2016

they still want to identify themselves as liberal. They only care about themselves the way the other libertarians do.

 

BobbyDrake

(2,542 posts)
3. Some ignorant people can't think beyond "legalize it!"
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 08:10 AM
Sep 2016

Some other ignorant people have gobbled up every lie and right-wing (and left-wing) smear against Clinton and are voting for Johnson to show everyone just how ignorant they can be.

Demsrule86

(68,456 posts)
4. No, if you support Gary Johnson you are not liberal.
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 08:12 AM
Sep 2016

There may be some who support legalization but you can't consider them liberal.

pnwmom

(108,955 posts)
5. Because he's positioning himself as an "independent," and there are lots of independents these days.
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 08:17 AM
Sep 2016

They don't realize that he isn't really an independent, he's a (mostly) rightwing libertarian.

TwilightZone

(25,426 posts)
23. Agreed.
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 12:58 PM
Sep 2016

Many of them believe that "independent" is a monolithic bloc of people who all believe most of the things that they believe. There were a significant number of them on DU during the primaries.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
8. The far left is not "sorta like liberals but just more so."
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 08:21 AM
Sep 2016

The far left is like the far right in most characteristics, with a few significant differences. They are one, however, in despising liberals and the Democratic Party. Of course many on the far left, wanting SOMEONE to vote for, chose third-party candidates, to spit on the Democrats if nothing else.

Btw, the notion that libertarians are "liberal" on social issues is not correct. True libertarians elevate the principle of INDIVIDUAL FREEDOM above all others, making the pursuit of selfishness a virtue. The stronger the libertarian, the higher it is elevated and less importance is given to any other principle.

Both conservatives and liberals believe in individual freedom but with limits to protect others. Libertarian ideology is almost devoid, to devoid of altruism, in which they differ strongly from both liberal and conservatives ideologies.

By and large, there are very few liberals supporting Johnson, only people mistakenly given that label, and no doubt a handful of confused idiots.

athena

(4,187 posts)
14. In other words, they can't think for themselves.
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 09:26 AM
Sep 2016

As a matter of fact, Hillary does not need their votes to win the election. We, her supporters, will make sure she wins this through the votes of her supporters alone.

However, these people's choice to vote for someone who doesn't even know what Aleppo is speaks volumes about exactly who they are, how politically unaware they are, and how little they care about what happens to those in this country who are less privileged than they are.

 

vi5

(13,305 posts)
17. Then what do you care?
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 11:26 AM
Sep 2016

If she doesn't need their votes, if they're so ignorant and privileged, why are so many people on here worrying so much about what they do and who they vote for?

You told them you don't need their votes. You told them you didn't care what they did. You called them naive and petulant and children and whatever else. They heard you loud and clear and now they are acting accordingly.

It can't be both ways. You can't say you don't care and they don't matter but then spend so much time worrying about what they are doing and getting mad at them when they act according to how you responded to and treated them.

Move on, and bask in the inevitable win of the candidate that you supported.

 

Madam45for2923

(7,178 posts)
21. Even if you dont care it's still good to know! To know where people are REALLY coming from!
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 12:50 PM
Sep 2016

Next time they tell us that some things/issues are very very important to them, we know to take it with a grain of salt! Aha!

 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
25. I suppose carrying the "inevitable" meme so long after its best-used-by date can be monotonous
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 01:03 PM
Sep 2016

I find it odd that you intentionally conflate "care" and knowledge" to better continue your narrative. I suppose carrying the "inevitable" meme so long after its best-used-by date can be monotonous, and additional creativity is required to maintain passion...

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
22. That aspect has been covered in numerous replies already.
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 12:55 PM
Sep 2016

They are simply fools.

I will expand on that. People using that as a reason are also self-centered with no sense of community. They are people we don't want to have any voice at all in the party.

 

bettyellen

(47,209 posts)
24. So it's out of spite as well as lack of principles? Sounds like you empathize with them. I can't.
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 01:01 PM
Sep 2016
 

vi5

(13,305 posts)
30. I don't agree with them but I do empathize with them.
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 02:06 PM
Sep 2016

I wasn't a fan of either of our choices this year, but it is what it is and I'm voting for Hillary.

But I watched the behavior and tone of a lot of Hillary supporters who said all the things I quoted above. And now that people actually listened to them they are still obsessing over it.

All the 3rd party threads on DU now by the same people that said what they said during the primary are just like the people I know who claim to be over their exes but yet still fixate on and obsess over them and won't shut the fuck about them. Nobody is buying it.

The point is now that we are where we are, fixating on a third party candidate whose voters are probably evenly split (if that) between usually Republican voters and usually liberal voters is idiotic. If the candidate you supported is so great and will have no problem winning as you claimed in months prior....then why are you fixating on supposedly liberal 3rd party voters?

But yeah, keep fixating and insulting. I'm sure that will definitely win over a lot of voters.

 

La Lioness Priyanka

(53,866 posts)
32. yes, i am sure someone else is responsible for their actions.
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 02:25 PM
Sep 2016

after all why should we expect adults to own their own behaviors?

 

vi5

(13,305 posts)
33. Trust me, I don't....
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 02:36 PM
Sep 2016

...otherwise all these people wouldn't be spending all of their time posting shit about third party voters and would be focusing more on backing up their own words and working as hard at getting their candidate elected as they are worrying about inconsequential third party voters.

If I thought people were responsible for their own behaviors, I'd be seeing a lot more mea culpas and maybe some slight admissions that we actually do need every vote and that insulting people and telling them they aren't needed isn't exactly a winning strategy.

saltpoint

(50,986 posts)
13. When Johnson's name is mentioned on the news,
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 09:22 AM
Sep 2016

what he says or does seems more ornery than thoughtful.

I'm surprised Bill Weld ever got on that bus.

Wednesdays

(17,311 posts)
16. There are liberals supporting Johnson?
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 09:45 AM
Sep 2016

If so, they're a subset of a subset of a subset of that MONSTROUS seven percent he's polling!

Wounded Bear

(58,598 posts)
19. I'm convinced that the whole Johnson pulls from Clinton is a myth...
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 11:33 AM
Sep 2016

there may be some random people on the street telling this to interviewers, but I don't buy it.

And I don't buy that many Bernie backers are voting for Johnson, either. I could see voting Stein, because she is at least a pseudo-leftist. Neither has many policy agreements with Bernie, so if someone backed Bernie on issues, I could see them staying home before voting 3rd party, especially with the options available.

IMNSHO, this is one of the biggest non-story stories in this election cycle.

 

vi5

(13,305 posts)
31. Exactly...this is all pre-emptive scapegoating.
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 02:10 PM
Sep 2016

A lot of people kept shouting about how Hillary was going to mop the floor with Trump and destroy him and win in a landslide, or whatever else they were going on about (not all, but some).

Now that they were proven wrong they are looking for people to blame and since it can never be them, and it can never be their preferred candidate, it must be the mythical third party voters.

The fact is that even if half of the Johnson voters are liberal (and I highly doubt this) that means the other half are not and would have been Republican voters who aren't voting for Trump. Which means it's a wash. And the fact is if we put up a candidate who can't beat someone like Trump by more than a few percentage points then maybe that points to bigger problems we have as a Democratic brand.

uponit7771

(90,301 posts)
36. Two different polls I've seen have shown 18 - 34 yr olds pulled to Johns in a big way.. beating
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 02:45 PM
Sep 2016

... tRump and Johnson coming in second to HRC.

That's were the pull is

Brother Buzz

(36,374 posts)
20. One could make the argument they are the same PUMA 'Liberals' that supported McCain
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 12:04 PM
Sep 2016

Low information voters that bought into the white-wing echo machine's relentless attacks on the Clintons for the last thirty years.

Freddie

(9,256 posts)
28. A Libertarian
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 01:27 PM
Sep 2016

Is a Republican who likes to get high.
Young people also like their no-foreign-intervention stance. They can't see past those 2 things to see how wrong the rest of their platform is.

MineralMan

(146,254 posts)
34. There aren't any liberals supporting Johnson.
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 02:36 PM
Sep 2016

Anyone supporting Johnson is, by definition, not a liberal or a progressive.

Pretty simple, really. People are as they act, not as they say.

democrattotheend

(11,605 posts)
38. One of my friends is
Thu Sep 22, 2016, 03:10 PM
Sep 2016

She is definitely a liberal, supported Bernie in the primary, but is casting a protest vote for Johnson. She doesn't really support him as much as seeing it as the least of all evils.

But she promised me she would vote for Hillary if her red-leaning state is polling within 5 points.

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