How is Bernie not burning bridges best preserved and giving Trump quotes to use against any

[Atticus]

Democrat in 2020 with his repeated criticisms of the party now providing the framework for his presidential run?

[Voltaire2]

1. Did you have a specific statement from

Senator Sanders that you are concerned about, or are we just supposed to guess?

Also, do you think Trump has some shortage of horseshit attacks that would cause him to just shut up and not attack us if only Senator Sanders had not said this unspecified bad thing?

Just asking for a friend.

[Atticus]

2. One example:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jun/11/bernie-sanders-lambasts-absolute-failure-of-democratic-partys-strategy

[Voltaire2]

5. 2017?

Like right after the Democratic Party suffered its worst electoral defeat in decades?

And you couldn’t even bother to provide a quote. So I chose one for you.

You disagree with this?

The Democratic party must understand what side it is on. And that cannot be the side of Wall Street, or the fossil fuel industry, or the drug companies

[Atticus]

6. Nearly took the bait and started to select some anti-Democrat quotes for you, but "Where to start?"

Bernie Sanders has been criticizing the Democratic Party since the '80's. If you want quotes, read his book, "Where We Go From Here". In it, he is equally critical of both major parties.

You can cherry pick the quotes you prefer, but I will not spoon-feed you the quotes that confirm Bernie's dislike of our party. Constructive criticism is useful. Repudiation of what we've consistently represented as a party and suggestions that everything be changed and now---is not.

[George II]

22. I received that book by contributing $1 to his campaign several months ago.....

...I started reading it and saw his disdain for OUR party and couldn't go on. Plus, there's not much in those 250+ pages that we haven't heard on the campaign trail anyway.

[betsuni]

7. How is the Democratic Party on the side of Wall Street, fossil fuel industry or drug companies?

All Democrats want to regulate those industries. Republicans do not.

[intheflow]

40. Democrats want to regulate those industries,

but most Democrats are still more than happy to accept lots of campaign money from them. That reliance for money makes them complicit, or, "on the side of" those industries. There's no way most humans would be able to resist such circumnavigated lobbying.

[betsuni]

41. It's illegal for them to take money from industries.

They receive donations from people who work in those industries and there are legal limits.

Dealing with lobbyists is part of the job of an elected official. Lobbyists are not handing them envelopes of cash. There are rules and limits to legally contribute to a candidate. A Democratic voter donating to Democrats is doing so because they are on the same side fighting for the same things. Otherwise, they'd donate to Republicans.

Al Franken:

"The proliferation of money in politics is a huge problem ... it has some pretty terrible consequences. But does this mean that elected officials are all bought and paid for? The truth, I've discovered, is a little more complicated. Campaign contributions don't buy votes. What they buy is access. That's why lobbyists write campaign checks. They're not bribes. They're grease. They enable those lobbyists to come to fund-raisers, where they get to talk to you while you're trying to remember their names. Gross, right? And it is! I hear from a lot of lobbyists. And, yes, some of them are every bit as transactional as you're imaging. But others, often the more effective ones, are actually passionate about the issue they're representing. And while lobbying -- and all the money associated with it -- offers lots of opportunities for corruption, lobbying itself isn't inherently corrupt. Many lobbyists represent good causes, like solar energy or Alzheimer's research or a woman's reproductive rights. They may have donated to you not in order to buy your support going forward, but because you've been supporting their good cause all along. And more often than not, you're not meeting with them because of a check they wrote, but rather because you're on the same side. You're strategizing together about how to move the ball forward, and trading useful information about how to achieve a shared goal."

[intheflow]

45. Yeah, SUCH a big difference between

rich individuals and the companies they work for that made them rich by exploiting the rest of us. No correlation at all.

Meanwhile, just ignore headlines like these:

Biden, Harris and Buttigieg rack up donations from big bank executives on Wall Street

DEMOCRATIC 2020 CANDIDATES PROMISED TO REJECT LOBBYIST DONATIONS, BUT MANY ACCEPTED THE CASH ANYWAY

DNC Members Vote Down Corporate Money Ban

Why Democrats’ old contributions will haunt them in 2020

[betsuni]

47. both sides-both sides-both sides-both sides-both sides-both sides-both sides

"The shift to Republican control has also extended the party's fundraising advantage ... . To give just one example of how funding trends have shifted, tobacco industry contributions to politicians prior to 1990 were split evenly between Democrats and Republicans. As Republicans have increasingly dominated traditionally tobacco-friendly states in the South, industry funding has swung accordingly. From 1991 to 1994, Republicans received 62 percent of the industry's political contributions; from 1995 to 2000, they received 82 percent. Similar trends have occurred in other business sectors. In 1990, agribusiness gave 56 percent of its contributions to Republicans. By 2002, that figure had climbed to 72 percent. During the same period, contribution to Republicans from the defense industry went from 60 to 69 percent; from construction, 53 to 65 percent; energy and natural resource extraction, 53 to 65 percent; finance, insurance and real estate, 48 to 58 percent; health care, 48 to 65 percent; transportation, 53 to 71 percent; other businesses, 59 to 65 percent. The only business sector to buck the trend was communications and electronics, which increased its giving to Democrats slightly, from 58 to 61 percent."

From "Banana Republicans"

[George II]

8. I think Senator Sanders should understand on what side it is. First he runs....

...in the 2012 Democratic primary for Senate, wins the nomination, and the next day rejects the nomination and runs as an independent.

Then he runs in the 2016 Democratic Presidential primary as a "Democrat", and even before he formally loses the nomination he registers for re-election as an independent in 2018.

Then he runs in the 2018 Democratic primary for Senate, wins the nomination, and the next day rejects the nomination and runs as an independent.

Now again he's running in the 2020 Democratic Presidential primary as a "Democrat".

How long is he going do this to us?

[Hassin Bin Sober]

10. You do know he is part of The Senate Democratic Leadership, yes?

You must not be aware of the fact Bernie is a member of the Senate Democratic Leadership


Best with sound on:

Link to tweet

[George II]

12. (#7) No he isn't, that isn't current. Here's the current membership of that committee:

https://www.democrats.senate.gov/dsoc

Chair - Amy Klobuchar

Members - Klobuchar, Shaheen, Schumer, Durbin, Leahy, Gillibrand, Coons, Casey, Tester, Schatz, and Baldwin.

So you can save yourself the trouble of posting that again.

[Eliot Rosewater]

28. Here we go again...The attacks and bashing of all things Democratic is not going

to stop and worse, his supporters will do it too.

[Cha]

34. lol.. Thanks for the UPDATE, George!

[George II]

9. Yes, 2017. And he's been saying similar things about MY party and OUR party for decades.

[DownriverDem]

14. Exactly why

I only support true members of the Democratic Party. Maybe one day folks will understand.

[betsuni]

43. "Both Sides, Selected Insults of the Democratic Party" by Bernie Sanders:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1287&pid=393125

[Hortensis]

3. Those vulnerable to Sanders' messages condemning

Democrats as conservative, even as Big Business supports HIM to keep us out of power, are wobbly at best.

Most of those who can actually believe there's hardly any difference between Democrats and Republicans (!), or refuse to recognize Russia/Repubs' use of him and them, are willfully blind. Most of those probably haven't voted for years, using our supposed corruption as a facile excuse for their own fecklessness, and of those who did vote believing this...?

But you're right. In 2020, our nation needs everyone to vote and to vote smart like never before.

[NurseJackie]

4. "wobbly" ... Yes. Perfect.

[Autumn]

11. Are you thinking Trump will only say something nasty about our candidate because... Bernie?

I got a bridge to sell you.

[Atticus]

13. I have no idea how you could in any way interpret my post to suggest that. Do you?

Or, was it just a good excuse to post your neat windy bridge video?

[Autumn]

23. I didn't have to interpret your post, it was very clear. I bolded your own words.

How is Bernie not burning bridges best preserved and giving Trump quotes to use against any

Democrat in 2020 with his repeated criticisms of the party now providing the framework for his presidential run?

Trump doesn't need to use others quotes. Trump already calls any Democrat, running or not, vile names and talks shit about them.

It's a nice bridge. I liked the picture, I'll probably use it again.

[Atticus]

25. I'll try this again: where did I say Trump will "ONLY" say nasty things about our

candidate because of what Bernie said? It is one thing if he makes up his own nasty insults, but it is another if he is simply quoting one of our candidates.

[Autumn]

30. Okay, you didn't use the word "only" you said Trump will say nasty things about our candidates

because ... Bernie. You know that other candidates have said things about the other candidates? Like Booker and Harris for two when they went after Biden. One could say they have given Trump quotes to use against any candidate we run. Candidates in a primary say things about other candidates. That's how our Democratic Party primaries works. We have several candidates running and they point out faults in our party that they think should be fixed and in each other.
Fuck him. Trump doesn't need to use others quotes. Trump already calls any Democrat, running or not, vile names and talks shit about them. He calls the Democratic party the party of traitors.

[Atticus]

35. ---Sigh---I did NOT say "Trump will say nasty things about our candidates because--- Bernie".

I agree that Trump will say terrible things about our candidate no matter who it is and without any help from Bernie. But, again, let the nastiness be his alone, not something one of ours said.

And, yes, other candidates have said things that may show up in a Trump ad, but none have Bernie's track record for dissing our party.

Finally, I doubt we are truly very far apart on this, but posting back and forth leaves a lot of blanks to fill in and sometimes we interpret wrongly. I like much of what Bernie advocates, but he is not my first choice for our nomination. I WILL vote for whoever we nominate and I hope you will do the same. Thanks.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

31. Pretty obvious plain English

[Autumn]

32. One would think that the only reason Trump will trash the Democratic Party and it's

candidates is because Bernie Sanders exists.

[DownriverDem]

15. No, but

do you really think attacking the Dems is the way to beat trump? I don't.

[Gothmog]

21. sanders is giving trump and Putin a great deal to work with

Russia worked hard to depress the vote in 2016 and was successful with African American voters. sanders has given trump and Putin a ton of material to use to keep democratic voters from showing up

Link to tweet

[CentralMass]

16. I don't know about you but I plan to vote for whoever wins the nomination.

Aside from that, Bernie has a very popular message/platform and broad support. Is it enough to beat Joe Biden ? Who knows, that's why we have elections. One person will win the nomination.

As I approach my 60th year on the planet I'm convinced we are and have been on the wrong path. Do I agree with everything that Bernie or Elizabeth Warren say or propose ? Probably not but I support their basic premise that we need to change the focus of our government and economy so that it works for all of us, including the least of us. I will gladly vote for either one of them over a candiate who tells rich donors that "Nothing would fundamentally change" if he's elected.



.

[Atticus]

17. I absolutely will vote for Bernie if he is our nominee, but I would prefer someone

who not only wants what I want, but has a reasonable chance of implementing those "wants". In the last election year, I peeled Bernie's sticker off my car after realizing he was very heavy on aspiration and very light on implementation.

But, yes, if he is nominated, I will support him.

[comradebillyboy]

18. It's why Bernie can't get more than 20% in the polls.

Bernie is an expert at burning bridges but he has no clue how to build bridges and expand his base.

[George II]

19. The last time he was over 20 was in April.

[Cha]

36. Yes he is.. Well said!

[Gothmog]

20. I am proud member of the Democratic Party

I will support the nominee of the party but I really doubt that the party will nominate sanders.

[aikoaiko]

24. He's fine and a sizable number of real Democrats support him.

I support Bernie's criticism of our party. I don't always agree, but I still support someone trying to help our party do better.

[Eliot Rosewater]

27. So you think people hearing endless attacks of the D party doesnt

convince some of them to not vote?

Facts are it does, it is VERY harmful...VERY

[aikoaiko]

29. No, not when someone with the gravitas of Bernie says to vote Democratic in the GE.

Ok, show me the facts that directly support your claim.

[Autumn]

33. I would like to see facts to back that up also.

[Gothmog]

37. Are you sure?

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

?s=20

[aikoaiko]

38. I'm sure. I'm OK with Bernie not winning as long as he keeps pushing the party in a better direction

In fact, I never said he was going to win. But he is doing well enough to stick around and influence.

[stopdiggin]

39. and I'm also OK with Sanders "pushing" the party

in a direction that he thinks is needed .. as long as HE ISN'T deriding those that are not in his camp as "cooperate","compromised", "sell-outs", "establishment" .. and you get the drift. In short, as long as he's ACTING like a positive influence .. rather than inciting the mob.

[Eliot Rosewater]

26. Now you are catching on...lemme know when we can t _ _ k about it

[NYMinute]

42. Because Bernie is not a Democrat

and he is ONLY for Bernie and no one else.

[betsuni]

44. K&R

[UniteFightBack]

46. Let me guess......only he alone can fix it. nt