Democratic Primaries
Related: About this forumIf Bernie Sanders is the nominee Trump will get a 2nd term (and America will be over).
I might be wrong but I don't think so.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Squinch
(50,949 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Botany
(70,504 posts)... sure that Bernie will be the nominee.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Squinch
(50,949 posts)their efforts still cost us the election. And you're right.
IT'S THE DEMOCRACY, STUPID!
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
She_Totally_Gets_It
(142 posts)Operation Chaos in VA since it's an open primary. They're all voting for Bernie Sanders.
When Steve Bannon was on Bill Maher last Friday, he defended Bernie Sanders left and right. Repeated the lie that Sanders was cheated in 2016 and that the DNC is corrupt. Why did he do that? Because he knows that a Sanders candidacy is sure to give Trump and the Republicans at least 30 states.
Truth is: the GOP is afraid of Biden, hence Giuliani's continued efforts to work with the Ukraine to tarnish him and his son--or, just make shit up.
The GOP is NOT afraid of Bernie Sanders, which is why they are hoping for him to be the nominee.
The GOP is also unafraid of Pete Buttigieg--all they have to do is play up the "gay angle" and there's enough homophobes and bigots around and across party lines to make a difference.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
C Moon
(12,213 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
She_Totally_Gets_It
(142 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
switch party affiliation at any time, so it's not really that idiotic.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
brutus smith
(685 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
She_Totally_Gets_It
(142 posts)When it comes to ultimate power, they're going to take it.
And I, for one, happen to agree with them. Bernie will give Trump at least 30 states and a landslide in the EC.
Is is unelectable. As a Warren supporter, you should know that. Elizabeth is miles ahead of Sanders on every issue and in every category. When it comes to my choice between the two, I go with Liz every single time.
Fuck Bernie Sanders. Really. Fuck him. He has been worse than Ralph Nader when it comes to outcomes for the Democratic Party. He doesn't know how to work GENUINELY with others. Bernie is about Bernie...just like Donald J. Trump.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Squinch
(50,949 posts)to boost Bernie was just to screw with our minds in 2020.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Response to She_Totally_Gets_It (Reply #38)
RandiFan1290 This message was self-deleted by its author.
Demsrule86
(68,572 posts)results for Sanders in New Hampshire. And it won't get easier.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Indepatriot
(1,253 posts)How many delegates has Joe won?
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Clash City Rocker
(3,396 posts)There are 50 states. Youve struck out the first batter and declared yourself the winner. It doesnt work that way.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Indepatriot
(1,253 posts)My first work on a campaign was with Walter Mondale, so I know how this works...but thanks for your concern...
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
hangaleft
(649 posts)I know one who wont. (Not me, and Im not gonna name her. But 90% of her posts are attacks against Bernie.) And I suspect there may be a relatively small handful of others here who wont vote for him. (Again, not me. If hes our nominee I will vote for him. Enthusiastically! Which is the clincher that hell lose.)
But, I digress.
Joe and Jane Democrat on the street are gonna have a hard time voting for a socialist. And my guess is many independents will have a hard time doing so, but will pull the lever for our current tyrant. Better the devil you know and all that.
I would love to see Bernie elected president. But, America simply wont elect a socialist candidate president. And youre living in a fantasy world if you think they will. As bad as Trump is, the IOA (idiots of America) will give Trump a second term before theyll give a socialist a first.
ETA Just to be clear, I have always voted for the Democratic candidate for president (and every other office, for that matter).
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
apcalc
(4,465 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
DownriverDem
(6,228 posts)get his supporters to understand he will not win in November? He has so much baggage that trump & the repubs will unleash on him. They will define him before the Dem Convention. His supporters are politically naive and don't understand what will happen. trump is destroying Biden because he knows he could beat him. No one is focused on who the voters will be in November.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
jimfields33
(15,801 posts)Stop the hyperbole please!!!!!
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Laelth
(32,017 posts)Probably because it's not necessarily true.
I suspect that any of our candidates could beat Trump in 2020. That said, coattails matter, and Bernie may not be our best bet to reclaim the Senate.
But the liberal energy in our party has to go somewhere. Bernie appears to have the deep and solid support of about 25% of Democrats. These people should not be dismissed, and they will not be ignored.
-Laelth
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
katmondoo
(6,457 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
irisblue
(32,974 posts)I'm having a hard time imagining 'socialist' anything getting the majority in that will be Senior voter state.
Enthusiasm of the rose twitter brigade regardless
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Indepatriot
(1,253 posts)I believe he or Warren are the only candidates who can beat Trump
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Yes. If one of them drops out of the race he/she should ask supporters to support the other.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
She_Totally_Gets_It
(142 posts)I do not hold that same view when it comes to Bernie Sanders and his supporters. I just don't.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
ramen
(790 posts)Any Sanders supporter (or any Biden supporter or Yang supporter) that does anything other than vote Democratic in November and volunteering and getting out the vote is a hapless moron. I'll be there if it's Bloomberg or Steyer or the ghost of Ronald Reagan that gets the nomination, at this point. And I'll canvas for said ghost or nonghost.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
KSNY
(315 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Demsrule86
(68,572 posts)wanted her support...or maybe Sanders shouldn't have said she lied...which we all know she didn't. Her supporters will decide for themselves. The Sanders campaign blew that with the script etc. I like Elizabeth Warren.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
sheshe2
(83,758 posts)Only if he wins the GE. Otherwise no.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
brush
(53,778 posts)Which is why trump keeps pushing for Sanders to win our nomination.
Check some of it out here:
https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287502598
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Fla Dem
(23,668 posts)the word is out for Trump supporters to change their affiliation and vote for Bernie in the primaries so he'll be the nominee. I'd love to know how many of those that changed their affiliation in NH voted for Bernie.
I have no proof of this, but knowing the dirty tricks the Republicans play I would be surprised if they didn't do this.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
SilasSouleII
(363 posts)If that's public information
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
calguy
(5,309 posts)I think you are extremely naïve to the political certainties here.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Indepatriot
(1,253 posts)the political certainties so far have Biden, the "frontrunner" with 0 delegates ....and I'm the naive one...
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
treefarmers
(24 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
treefarmers
(24 posts)Just an FYI - After the debate last night I am switching my vote to Warren
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Watchfoxheadexplodes
(3,496 posts)Revolution be damned
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
MANative
(4,112 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
zentrum
(9,865 posts)...but I do think it's true of several other candidates.
As I understand it, black people were voting for Biden primarily because they reasoned Biden was the white guy other white people would vote for and so we'd get rid of Trump. But Biden seems to be really losing momentum. Big time. So I think those black voters will shift to Bernie.
I love Elizabeth but she's lost momentum too and I worry the country is still too sexist to vote for a woman. I just don't want to risk it.
As for Pete, I don't think America is ready for a First Husband. The country is too retrograde.
Bernie's support is growing among black people, Latinos and for sure, young people.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
She_Totally_Gets_It
(142 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
SilasSouleII
(363 posts)That means they are NOT going to vote for Bernie. My gut feeling is that they will be breaking for Bloomberg if Biden is no longer viable.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
brush
(53,778 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
blueinredohio
(6,797 posts)I'm afraid it will be to Trumps advantage.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ancianita
(36,055 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
blueinredohio
(6,797 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ancianita
(36,055 posts)stop from happening what the occupant has said he'll do "soon," and move House bills into law without filibuster, judges into courts, money back into serving taxpayers, etc. We know he can, because he did it four years ago, and his supporters, not just youth, are still around.
Just my opinion.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
blueinredohio
(6,797 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
C Moon
(12,213 posts)Because in my eyes, Trump is a prisoner sitting in the Whitehouse. He has more dirt on him than a stray dog.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
blueinredohio
(6,797 posts)Republicans don't care how bad Trump is they will vote for him. I'll vote blue no matter who but that's my opinion.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
cilla4progress
(24,731 posts)unless maybe Amy as VP? Or Val Demings, Stacy Abrams, MichelleO, Oprah (see a theme?).
Of course, this is what we thought in '16.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
She_Totally_Gets_It
(142 posts)a black woman on his ticket. But because he deplores "Identity Politics" I'd be surprised at that happening. If he were smart, that's what he would do, and I would consider voting for him should that happen.
I don't think it will, though.
Bernie Sanders is unelectable. Black voters are smarter than we're given credit for.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
cilla4progress
(24,731 posts)so helpful!
I have nephews campaigning for Bernie and I asked them if they have any inside info on Bernie's VP choice.
Question: would you include Nina Turner in that list?
Also: I agree that the Dem party has taken Black voters for granted for far too long. I hope that's changing.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
NY06DemSoc
(42 posts)I enjoy listening to her speak and she has an incredible passion. Bernie is already pretty passionate and I don't know that she balances the ticket in that regard.
Susan Rice would balance the ticket in a lot of regards, experienced, foreign policy, female, black, more moderate and doesn't have a significant profile in terms of the Right Wing Hate Machine. She's on their radar because "Benghazi" but I think that only resonates with the fringe who would never vote for a D anyway.
I don't know if Kamala Harris' politics or ego would make here a suitable VP but I'd support her for the role.
I think Klobuchar could do it, but her politics are less radical and I think she'd be uncomfortable. While we could count on the Gov. of MN to appoint a D in her absence, I'd be more concerned about the General election for her seat as MN is less reliably blue than MA or CA and we don't want to endanger our chances of taking (and holding) the Senate.
I also think Identity Politics is more of a curse than a blessing though.
My own feeling is that Warren would be a great VP. Though it wouldn't hurt to bring in some younger blood to deepen our bench a bit too.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
amuse bouche
(3,657 posts)She's a huge turnoff. It's really a shame
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
NY06DemSoc
(42 posts)I just imagined AG Kamala Harris. I want her to hunt down and prosecute every bit of malfeasance on the part of every member of the Trump administration down to the coffeve boy.
I want to see them cry as she nails their slimy hides to the wall.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Watchfoxheadexplodes
(3,496 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Squinch
(50,949 posts)and he doesn't have a black woman on his ticket?
Because I can't stand the guy but I'd walk barefoot over glass to vote for him instead of Filthy Donnie.
Are you saying you would stay home?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Response to Squinch (Reply #83)
Post removed
Squinch
(50,949 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Response to Squinch (Reply #104)
Post removed
Squinch
(50,949 posts)The Democracy is at stake. I have no respect for your position.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
TwilightZone
(25,471 posts)Trump must be stopped. That is the primary consideration. Every one of our candidates would be light-years better than Trump, and we need turnout for down-ticket races.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
shawn703
(2,702 posts)if it happens to be someone you don't completely agree with. Did you make a wrong turn somewhere and end up on the wrong discussion board?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ancianita
(36,055 posts)with Run the Jewels, and will likely be talking up any Democrat who becomes the frontrunner, but he and the crowds go nuts over Bernie.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Callado119
(171 posts)The looming disaster of nominating a candidate with so many liabilities can be seen by most of us. It wont be hard to make him more unpopular than trump especially with the suburban voters we need, and the the first two contests prove hes not bringing out young people like he promised their turnout is flat or down.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
oasis
(49,383 posts)of losing our democracy. Now is not the time to roll the dice on some half-baked "revolution".
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
apcalc
(4,465 posts)My Republican friends , however, would call him the commissar. This is in the mid-90s.
The oppo research on Sanders is extensive and damning.
And he knows it too.
Time to move to someone different.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
honest.abe
(8,678 posts)For someone who is on the fence between Trump and Sanders and questions how is he going to do all this stuff and not ruin the economy or blow the national debt, how should we answer that?
I guess the best argument would be something like this..
"Don't worry a President Sanders wont be able to get any of his pet policies passed anyway with a divided government... so essentially things will just continue as they are."
Ugh.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
HarlanPepper
(2,042 posts)Always thought we peaked somewhere between 1945-47. Its been managed decline ever since.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Bayard
(22,071 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
HarlanPepper
(2,042 posts)Cue Lee Greenwood. Didnt mean to offend your American exceptionalism thingy.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Squinch
(50,949 posts)Oh, wait. No it wasn't
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
HarlanPepper
(2,042 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Squinch
(50,949 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
StevieM
(10,500 posts)Gore won and we just declared Bush the winner anyway. That is not how democracies are supposed to work.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ZenDem
(442 posts)What were things 'really' like in the 40's? If you happen to be a woman, POC, LGBTQ or, hell...a child!...things weren't as rosy. I was born in the 60s and things were still shitty.
I believe that in general, things are improving. The squeaky wheels are louder and have a larger format to spread their crap, but humanity is more tolerant, more accepting, more open-minded than ever before. That's likely the reason why the assholes are fighting harder and louder, but there really are more of 'us'.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
HarlanPepper
(2,042 posts)Our situation with race was obviously fucked back then.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ZenDem
(442 posts)I was discussing the enormous gap between the perceived living wage and min wage with my son this weekend. Neither of us is in a position to complain, but how to explain the damage to society as a whole to people that believe we are currently living the 'best US economy since, like, ever!' seems impossible.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Martin Eden
(12,867 posts)But I hoped he would stay out of it this time, and I've seen nothing to change my mind on that.
Bernie did us all a great service by making progressive policy solutions more mainstream in the Democratic Party, but he is more of a divisive figure now when what we urgently need is unity.
Also, Sanders & Biden will both turn 80 about halfway through the next presidential term. Call me an ageist, but every human being is on the decline by that age and POTUS is perhaps the most demanding job in the world (unless you're a criminal sociopath like Trump).
Nevertheless, my primary vote will go to the candidate I think has the best chance to beat Trump. I have until the Illinois primary to decide.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
renate
(13,776 posts)I voted for him in the 2016 primary too, and I also wish he had stayed out this time. He's too old, he's too socialist (I mean, please. No matter how much his supporters love him and his policies, can you really imagine a Midwestern grandparent going out on election day to stand in line to vote for him?), and unfortunately too cranky. GOPers like tough guys, so for them the bigger the asswipe a person is the better, but we like our politicians to be polite and friendly.
Obviously I would crawl over broken glass to vote for him, like I would for anybody not named Trump, but he simply cannot win a general election. He just can't. It would be an absolute wipeout for us and for all the down-ballot races as well.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Pacifist Patriot
(24,653 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
MH1
(17,600 posts)I was really disappointed in Bernie for not doing the right thing this time.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Martin Eden
(12,867 posts)And we are all together.
I don't know that Bernie can't win the general election, because I think GOTV is more important than trying to persuade "swing" voters who still might cast their ballot for Trump.
Will Democrats stay home because they don't like Sanders?
As opposed to:
How many Bernie folks will vote Green if their man loses in the primary to a "moderate" they find unacceptable?
I don't know, but I still wish Bernie had stayed out.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
deurbano
(2,895 posts)My candidate, Warren, seems unusually fit for her age--mentally and physically very agile, plus she's 8 years younger than Sanders-- but I do wish she were a bit younger. Biden will be 78 in Nov, and Bloomberg will be be 78 in two days! I'm younger than Elizabeth Warren by five years, and in addition to my extensive lack of any other presidential qualifications, I'm also too old. Again, Warren seems to be in great shape (much better than I am!), and I will happily vote for her, but I don't think it's ageist to consider age, especially for those approaching 80.
I voted for Sanders for governor (I think he got about 10%) when I lived in VT in the 1970s, and I followed his political career with interest and support after that. (I took my family to meet him at a book signing in Berkeley in the late 90s, and we talked about VT.) I started out 2016 supporting him, but switched to Clinton by the CA primary. Like you, I hoped he wouldn't run this time, and have a lot of apprehension about his prospects as nominee. The UK will now have Boris-effin-Johnson for five more years! We can't really afford another minute of the MAGAt King, much less another term.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Martin Eden
(12,867 posts)However, I have electability concerns about Liz.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
marble falls
(57,081 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,572 posts)our only chance.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
yuiyoshida
(41,831 posts)and Tom Steyer are starting to look pretty good, and Bloomberg knows Trump, knows his Kryptonite...but I will vote for whoever we choose.. however, I have to agree with most in this thread, I think Trump will turn people away from Bernie...As Han Solo often said " I have a bad feeling about this!"
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,572 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Squinch
(50,949 posts)I agree about Bloomberg, but maybe Amy will catch fire.
I love Pete but it would be too easy to Dukakis him.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,572 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Squinch
(50,949 posts)powerful cabinet spot.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
MontanaMama
(23,314 posts)We might survive as a nation if we take back the Senate but lose the WH. I don't want to consider that but its there.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,572 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Amimnoch
(4,558 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
onecaliberal
(32,858 posts)Period! To ignore that, is to ignore history. Democrats can not win elections without them.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Squinch
(50,949 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Green Line
(1,123 posts)Joe is my first choice, but if he falters, I'm voting for Bloomberg on super Tuesday.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Desert grandma
(804 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
musette_sf
(10,201 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Scotch-Irish
(464 posts)America is over right now. Bernie can undo some of the brainwashing that faux news has poisoned this country with.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
McKim
(2,412 posts)Yes Sanders can win and I hope he asks Warren to be Vice President. They would be a great team to make America Fair Again!!!!!
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ancianita
(36,055 posts)Youth of at least two generations are going to flock to GOTV for Bernie, AND flock to be a part of this party and a new generation's government.
That is the future vision that Bernie can sell to beat Trump.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Scotch-Irish
(464 posts)Democratic socialism is the future of America if we don't want to become (more) fascist.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
ancianita
(36,055 posts)his support.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Squinch
(50,949 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ancianita
(36,055 posts)students voting in their state, it seems.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Squinch
(50,949 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ancianita
(36,055 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Squinch
(50,949 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ancianita
(36,055 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Squinch
(50,949 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ancianita
(36,055 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Squinch
(50,949 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,572 posts)I am very afraid and will not vote for Sanders in a primary...but I will throw my support to Bloomberg who might be able to beat Trump.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
azureblue
(2,146 posts)yep Pure FUD. Stupid FUD too. OP, Go try to scare some hamster..
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Cha
(297,220 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
question everything
(47,479 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Dave in VA
(2,037 posts)Worked my ass off for McGovern. Took the semester off from college. Went in everyday to our local headquarters and did everything I could for his election. Thought we were bringing the same type of revolution.
Got our asses kicked!
Deja Vu here we come!
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Zolorp
(1,115 posts)I see no possible path to victory for Sanders in a general election.
In fact I see a trouncing at least nearly as bad as 1984, possibly 1972, and if anybody could do the unthinkable and hand Trump a unanimous Electoral College win, it is Bernie Sanders.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
awesomerwb1
(4,268 posts)but we may lose the majority in the house as well.
One question no Bernie fan can answer is why trump/gop and Russia bots/hackers are trying to help Bernie.
Crickets.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
mysteryowl
(7,389 posts)There are issues with all the candidates, because, surprise, they are human!
We will need to work hard for any of our nominees.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)There is NO easy path. No sure bet, right now.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
mysteryowl
(7,389 posts)It is not a fair election. We have voter suppression and foreign governments messing with our elections.
Don't despair! Get active! GOTV
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Piratedog
(256 posts)Who can bring the Folks that voted for Obama in 2008 and 2012 but who then voted for Trump in 2016?
Who can get the moderate conservatives who would rather not vote for Trump again but will do so unless there is a better alternative?
In Michigan, Penn, Florida, Ariz, NC, and Ohio
Everything thiNg else is just noise.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Piratedog
(256 posts)Anyone to far left will be like Dukakis v Bush
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Response to Piratedog (Reply #40)
Post removed
Piratedog
(256 posts)McGovern. 1972. Lost bad. Far left
Mondale. 1984. Lost bad. Far left
Dukakis. 1988. Lost bad. Far left
Clinton. 1992 and 1996. Won. Moderate
Gore. 2000. Moderate. Supreme Court decided
Kerry. 2004. Moderate. Lost but not bad
Obama. 2008 and 2012. Won. Moderate
Clinton. 2016. Lost but Russia stepped in
Forgot Carter. 1976. Won. Moderate
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
progressoid
(49,990 posts)All had something else in common. They weren't very inspiring.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Botany
(70,504 posts)... the election to Trump that was done by the Russians*. HRC got more votes in 2016 than anybody
in history except for Obama in 2008 and when you count in that 16 million democratic voters were
removed from voting prior to the election she really did win easily.
* Russia was in all 50 states and heavily in targeted states such as Wisconsin where they were in
all the way to the county level. https://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/story/news/politics/2019/11/06/2020-elections-in-wisconsin-submit-your-questions-on-voting-dnc/4169944002/
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
She_Totally_Gets_It
(142 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
jb5150
(1,178 posts)Bernie may not be my first choice, but if he's the eventual nominee he's got my vote . I'm voting blue no matter who.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
brooklynite
(94,554 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Woodycall
(259 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
brooklynite
(94,554 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
The Velveteen Ocelot
(115,692 posts)He also made it clear that he was not a socialist. His New Deal programs were intended to recover the economy from the Depression, not to redesign the American economic structure. The left wing hated him as much as the right wing did.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
amuse bouche
(3,657 posts)They are vicious. Almost as bad as MAGAts
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Calculating
(2,955 posts)IMO Biden would be like handing the election to Trump on a silver platter. An old unexciting candidate with a bunch of potential skeletons in the closet(Hunter Biden), who will completely fail at inspiring youth turnout. I've talked to some 20 somethings and they say if the Dems select Biden they'll just stay home or vote Trump for 'The Memes'. I'm for Bernie, but realistically I think Amy might have the best shot at winning this.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
awesomerwb1
(4,268 posts)That says a lot about Sanders' support. It's Bernie or bust. Shocker. Cut your nose to spite your face.
You do realize Sanders is older than Biden right?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)Wtf? Hunter Biden?
Are you trying to push Trumped up conspiracies here?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Calculating
(2,955 posts)Can you objectively tell me that the Hunter Biden thing ISN'T gonna be an issue in the general? You just know it will become the new 'Hillary Emails' thing to scare the gullible.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)But you go with that conspiracy shit and let the GOP call the shots.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Woodycall
(259 posts)General Election: Trump vs. Biden Quinnipiac Biden 50, Trump 43 Biden +7
General Election: Trump vs. Sanders Quinnipiac Sanders 51, Trump 43 Sanders +8
General Election: Trump vs. Warren Quinnipiac Warren 48, Trump 44 Warren +4
General Election: Trump vs. Bloomberg Quinnipiac Bloomberg 51, Trump 42 Bloomberg +9
General Election: Trump vs. Buttigieg Quinnipiac Buttigieg 47, Trump 43 Buttigieg +4
General Election: Trump vs. Klobuchar Quinnipiac Klobuchar 49, Trump 43 ,Klobuchar +6
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Piratedog
(256 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
mwooldri
(10,303 posts)We see plenty of polls where X Democratic potential candidate Vs DJT beats DJT easily but what about on a state by state basis? Could Bernie (or any other candidate for that matter) beat DJT in the electoral college?
I believe the "Generic Democrat" Vs DJT beats the Trump - so things look good in that regard but there's no such thing as a "Generic Democrat".
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
mikeysnot
(4,756 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
James48
(4,436 posts)And why do we keep having these discussions?
MUCH OF AMERICA WANTS BERNIE!
Let's just see how it goes, without all these negative waves, ok Moriarity?
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
yaesu
(8,020 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
handmade34
(22,756 posts)Bernie is my Senator... most of Vermont likes him
Vermont is kind of a world of its own
as liberal as some of us are and as much as we keep electing Bernie... the people of Vermont still can't implement the policies Bernie is proposing... what does that say about Alabama or Florida or what have you state...
Bernie can win in the Northeast maybe and maybe other states but we will lose the electoral college and that is the only thing we need to be concerned about right now...
the Republicans will be vicious... they will dig up stuff, they will lie, they will feed on people's fears... they will do that no matter who the nominee is but with Bernie, it goes to a whole other level
a Bernie nominee is dangerous and wrong at this time... I know it in my bones and my bones do not lie
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
apcalc
(4,465 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
jg10003
(976 posts)Unlike the other candidates, except maybe Warren, Sanders has a message that is more than just Im not trump. Trump appealed to the anti-establishment frustrations the working class. But he did it
by inflaming their fears, anxieties, and prejudices. Sanders addresses peoples frustrations by giving them hope. Remember that in 2016 many trump supporters said they would vote for Sanders, even though they had opposite positions on most issues.
trump and Sanders appeal to the same concerns of those who feel left behind by the establishment of both parties. But Sanders does it in a positive and hopeful way.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)He is the most divisive candidate we could nominate and it would be a disaster for all down ticket candidates.
There is nothing positive in Sanders demeanor or messaging.
By the way....that establishment boogeyman is laughable. Bernie Sanders is as establishment as they come. Propped up by the Democratic Party for over three decades.
Thanks, but No Thanks.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Response to Botany (Original post)
Post removed
BusyBeingBest
(8,052 posts)But then I'm not completely confident about any of our field. But yeah, America would be over. It already sort of is, in some respects.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
johnthewoodworker
(694 posts)will never beat trump. We will never unite against a republican unless the one candidate wins who is supported by a majority of black, hispanic, Asian, white, gay, straight, young, old, women, men, independent voters. No one candidate is going to appeal to every demographic.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
berksdem
(595 posts)I dont see Bernie winning the much needed swing states. My own home of PA would not go Bernie but I guess stranger things have happened. I will vote blue no matter what but my gut tells me Bernie would get beat by Trump.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
rwsanders
(2,599 posts)And of course you are right, because the Clinton nomination worked out so well.
Outside of the "bubble" 71% of democratic voters want more progressive policies.
There is no middle according to recent analysis, it is a matter of motivating the base and attracting voters that would otherwise stay home. This round even Robert Reich says a "moderate" won't do that.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
the_sly_pig
(741 posts)We won the popular vote in 2016 and well do it again in 2020. The electoral college needs to do their friggen job and vote for the party representing the constitution, law and order.
Picking on one candidate that will lose the election for us is juvenile.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
As near as i can figure it the ONLY nominee who can successfully beat Mr. Trump is Michael Bloomberg. Nice moderate Republican that sane folks will gladly vote for to get rid of the orange menace. Not a real Democrat but it will have to do for the nonce.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
More_Cowbell
(2,191 posts)So I'm not writing anyone off yet; I need to wait until Super Tuesday.
I also would like to know who Sanders would choose as a running mate. His choice for VP would matter more than most, to me, with his age and health issues.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
You are probably correct, he will be labeled a socialist or communist, but Trump will use both as weapon's. Sad but true, the end could be near for this country!
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
NoMoreRepugs
(9,425 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
extvbroadcaster
(343 posts)He's old. He's a socialist. He's your crazy grandpa who yells at clouds. Trump will run over him like a truck. It's Bloomberg or it's 4 more years of Trump.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Mazeltov Cocktail
(569 posts)I, of course, will vote for him...but I hope he isn't the candidate.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Cicada
(4,533 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)Bribery, blackmail, fraud, treason....
Trump didnt win shit. He STOLE the election with the help of the Republican Party, the Russians, the director of the FBI and many others.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Pepsidog
(6,254 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
LastLiberal in PalmSprings
(12,586 posts)As much as I like Sanders as a man and his proposed policies, the word "socialist" is enough to scare away half the independent voters, especially the older ones.
For more than 50 years we were conditioned to react like Pavlov's dog to the word "communist," hating and fearing that which we didn't understand, but knowing that the only acceptable response is "duck and cover."
I have heard the Right Wing conflate the terms "socialist" and "communist" with increasing frequency. If Bernie is our nominee that can only increase until only the latter term is used to describe Sanders.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Awsi Dooger
(14,565 posts)Tons of initial enthusiasm, some great speeches, some fiery debate performances. Moderates rationalizing that perhaps they were wrong.
Encouraging poll numbers
We'd be feeling pretty good about ourselves until those opposition commercials started to show up, even more despicable and devastating than forecast. The word socialist dominating social media and mainstream media and all the arguments at work.
Eventually you realize turnout means nothing. The enthusiasm is contained in small boxes. Middle America quietly shows up and rejects.
Narrow defeat that should have been avoided given a more competent choice during the primaries
Sanders supporters mean well but they don't understand situational realities. The swing states including Florida and the crucial midwestern states all have more self-identified conservatives than liberals, just like the nation itself. We'd be forcing a socialist into states that have 4-11% more conservatives than liberals. The math doesn't work. Fear would dictate the outcome.
Amy Klobuchar is very similar to Gwen Graham, the moderate who would have defeated Ron DeSantis in Florida if only we'd given her the chance. None of this Sanders stuff is theoretical to those of us who followed Florida in 2018.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
totodeinhere
(13,058 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
lucca18
(1,241 posts)The top three issues:
1) Defeating Trump
2) Beating Trump
3) Making sure Trump loses
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Response to Botany (Original post)
usaf-vet This message was self-deleted by its author.
bitterross
(4,066 posts)That's not a popular opinion with many people here. It's true I believe, though.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
EveHammond13
(2,855 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
lillypaddle
(9,580 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Dr Rise
(99 posts)Bernie will win easily if nominated. You're wrong about Sanders' supporters ... we WILL vote for whomever the nominee is. BTW, can anyone give me dirt on Sanders? I don't think there is any. The opposition can only scare people about socialism, which we will get to define for everyone.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Indepatriot
(1,253 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Piratedog
(256 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Indepatriot
(1,253 posts)Courting Republican votes in this day is a fool's errand.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Cha
(297,220 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
apcalc
(4,465 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
mchill
(1,018 posts)<snip>
A week after the 2016 election, Kurt Eichenwald of Newsweek noted that, of strategic necessity, Hillary Clinton had treated Sanders with extreme gentility. Trump would not have been so kind, Eichenwald continued:
So what would have happened when Sanders hit a real opponent, someone who did not care about alienating the young college voters in his base? I have seen the opposition book assembled by Republicans for Sanders, and it was brutal. The Republicans would have torn him apart. And while Sanders supporters might delude themselves into believing that they could have defended him against all this, there is a name for politicians who play defense all the time: losers.
Here are a few tastes of what was in store for Sanders, straight out of the Republican playbook. He thinks rape is A-OK. In 1972, when he was 31, Sanders wrote a fictitious essay in which he described a woman enjoying being raped by three men. Yes, there is an explanation for ita long, complicated one, just like the one that would make clear why the Clinton emails story was nonsense. And we all know how well that worked out.
Then theres the fact Sanders was on unemployment until his mid-30s, and that he stole electricity from a neighbor after failing to pay his bills, and that he co-sponsored a bill to ship Vermonts nuclear waste to a poor Hispanic community in Texas, where it could be dumped. You can just see the words environmental racist on Republican billboards. And if you cant, I already did. They were in the Republican opposition research book as a proposal on how to frame the nuclear waste issue.
<snip>
https://thebulwark.com/this-is-how-trump-would-destroy-bernie-sanders/
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)I dont think there is any.
socialism, which we will get to define for everyone
So much fanatical delusion in one post.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ehrnst
(32,640 posts)Republicans claim Nancy Pelosi is intentionally helping Joe Biden and hurting Bernie Sanders by delaying the Senate impeachment trial
Trump and His Aides Focused for Now on 2 Rivals (Neither Is the Front-Runner)
Republican strategist Karl Rove says Bernie Sanders could beat Donald Trump in 2020
Republicans pray for Bernie as Democratic nominee
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Kurt V.
(5,624 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
nancy1942
(635 posts)A recipe for another disaster. America is already on the brink.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Not sure if you have some magic crystal ball -- all the polls show that he will beat Trump handily. I think we over analyze and triangulate too much. This is what lead to the debacle in 2016. Vote for who you believe is the right candidate. I think it is Sanders.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Gothmog
(145,231 posts)If sanders is the nominee, trump will win 45+ states and we will have a Speaker of the House named Kevin McCarthy
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Alliepoo
(2,217 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
notinkansas
(1,096 posts)As well as a lot of other people.
Vote blue no matter who.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Still In Wisconsin
(4,450 posts)If Bernie is nominated and runs on his "revolution," Trump will carry 40 states and have upwards of 350 electoral votes. Bernie would also probably mean enough down-ticket losses to hand the House and Senate to the Republicans, along with several state legislatures. The latter is quite troublesome in a census year as this would give the Republicans the ability to gerrymander state elections for many cycles to come. Bernie's a loner in the Senate because he wants to be, and that's fine but as the de facto leader of the party he'd be a disaster, because, well, Bernie cares about Bernie.
No thanks. I'd vote for anyone else in the primary, even Gabbard.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
tiredtoo
(2,949 posts)Please stop the circular firing squad so i can relax from politics for a bit and tend to personal matters.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
azureblue
(2,146 posts)To Sanders. Gawd, who pays you to spread this crap. Your game - attack who ever is out front. Yawn...
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Chicago1980
(1,968 posts)You're not helping with your cynicism.
If you and anyone else with any ounce of sense votes blue no matter who... we can win.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
jalan48
(13,865 posts)we can blame Bernie or his supporters for the loss.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Dream Girl
(5,111 posts)He's got his $$$ a sliver of a chance to become president. Adoration of millions and all that, so it's all good for him. If it don't work out for him, then oh well, he's 78 and had a good run. Not so much for the rest of us.He don't care.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ihaveaquestion
(2,538 posts)EVERYONE must vote for the Democratic Nominee. Who. Ever. It. Is. PERIOD!
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
CaptainTruth
(6,591 posts)Trump & the GOP have been sending out the "America will never be a socialist country" message for quite a while now, & it whips the GOP base into a frenzy. (And resonates with enough Independents to make a difference, that's the key.) They equate socialism with communism. I have an otherwise intelligent & caring Christian (really) family member who has posted some really anti-socialism crap on Facebook. It's all about the "failure of socialism" in other countries that left citizens poor & destitute, when in reality, it was the corruption of the government (& politicians lining their own pockets at taxpayer expense) that created the poverty "failure" in those countries. (Ponder the absolute freaking irony of that for a while ... please ... just try to do it ... it makes my freaking brain hurt.)
And this is why I don't think Sanders can beat Trump. It's not because Sanders has any massive shortcomings, I'm sure a Sanders presidency would be a fine one ... it's because Trump & the GOP will pull out the "socialism stick" & beat Bernie bloody with it (figuratively speaking, of course) & in the process convince enough Independents that "socialism is evil" that Bernie will lose. And, if you don't believe that it's Independents that decide our elections today ... you really need to take a deep dive into party registration numbers & election results by party (or "non-party" . "Independents" are now the largest voting block.
It's also important to note that the Independents who decide our elections are not highly ideological, or highly partisan. They can be easily persuaded to vote D/R based on arguments that they consider "convincing" (whether factual or not) & that decision is often more emotional than intellectual. The "anti-socialism" argument can be made in a way that is very emotional, even when it is 100% non-factual.
Just to be clear: MY 100% GOAL IS TO DEFEAT TRUMP AND SAVE OUR COUNTRY!
I realize some folks here may not agree with my analysis of the situation, but I truly hope we all agree on the goal we are trying to achieve.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
maryallen
(2,172 posts)There is no evidence that your accusations would occur. Bernie has been around a long time, serving Vermont as a mayor, a U.S. Rep. to Congress, and a Senator. He has been re-elected to office many times by the people of Vermont. If you have proof that Bernie would cause the downfall of American democracy, please state your reasons.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Indepatriot
(1,253 posts)Cause otherwise His/Her opinion is only worth the digital space it inhabits. History tells us that nearly every time the Democrats nominate the "safe, pragmatic" candidate they lose. Mondale (who I first volunteered for), Dukakis, Gore, HRC, all "pragmatic centrists" who lost. Bill Clinton would probably have lost too without Ross Perot funneling off votes. When we go big, we win> BERNIE 2020!
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
ouija
(397 posts)Its an indictment on America not Sanders.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
LisaM
(27,811 posts)I think that's one of his goals, anyway. I've thought that for five years.
Can you see him as the titular head of a party he pretty much despises? At a time when the Democratic party platforms are in line with most American voters, and when a Democratic congress has flexed its knuckles? Poof, that will all go away if he's the head of the party.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
wisteria
(19,581 posts)They won't work with them. IMO
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Galraedia
(5,025 posts)I remember about 4 months before the election in 2016 polls showing Bernie Sanders having a better chance winning the election and Hillary Clinton losing to Donald Trump. I ignored it and Hillary Clinton eventually did lose. Democrats need to stop looking at Sanders as the enemy. While I may not like all of Sander's supporters, he has a large base that is motivated to vote for him. I will support him or anyone else in the general election.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
IronLionZion
(45,442 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
MyMission
(1,850 posts)The same can be said for any democratic candidate. Most of us fear each will cost us votes of some segment or other.
Your post could have, and should have said " If Bernie Sanders is the nominee, I FEAR rump will get a 2nd term (and America will be over). It's your fear that made you post that. Others who agree with you fear the same. Those of us who disagree are clearly more open minded and accepting, but also fearful.
I've noted a lot of Bernie"haters" at DU, perhaps because he's an independent rather than an avowed Democrat, or perhaps because he's a challenge to the status quo. He's not my choice but I'd vote for him in a heartbeat...no matter who, vote blue !!!
The pendulum swings. One of my profound observations and favorite expressions. Its' momentum allowed for rump to get elected. I see it swinging in the other direction, to someone who will be the antithesis of him. He certainly motivates and fires up a large number of people who will turn out to vote for him.
And shame on Hillary for bashing him too.
Your post made me wish du had a Not recommended button as well as a recommended.
I understand your fears, but it's not a helpful or hopeful post.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
wisteria
(19,581 posts)But, I don't think Trump is going to last his entire four years, and at some point he is no longer going to be useful to the Republicans.
I like to think of Sanders as the new McGovern, and Trump as Nixon. History may well repeat itself.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
njhoneybadger
(3,910 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Runningdawg
(4,516 posts)to push the big blue button on election day - even it if the name attached is your worst enemy.
Otherwise, it won't be Trump who kills this country.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Progressive dog
(6,904 posts)That seems to be what Trump thinks, too.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
highplainsdem
(48,976 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
DesertRat
(27,995 posts)and it's a frightening thought.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
jcmaine72
(1,773 posts)Bernie is the only one of the Democratic candidates who can realistically take a significant portion of Dotard's disillusioned WWC base away from him. He's also the most popular Democratic candidate among voters 30 or younger. The key to victory will ultimately be turnout, no matter who the Democratic nominee is.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
JudyM
(29,241 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Happy Hoosier
(7,308 posts)You are kidding yourself, IMO. For every voter Sanders brings in, he'l lose two, IMO.
I hope you are right and I am wrong. But I don't think that's the case.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
dchill
(38,489 posts)...on your over-the-top headline.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
cwydro
(51,308 posts)But I agree.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
pattyloutwo
(279 posts)I dont think its productive or helpful for us to say trump will win. Even if hes not our preferred candidate, well fight like hell to defeat Trump.
PS: I dont like the sexism but I understand the pull toward his policies.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
BlueMTexpat
(15,369 posts)But then, I am pretty confident that Sanders will NOT be the nominee ... for many reasons.
We have some excellent candidates. If Democrats STICK TOGETHER and VOTE FOR whoever is the nominee, that person can win. That's the truth. It is when we have people breaking off into factions that we don't win.
The Thug-in-Chief is indeed intimidating. It's time to call his bluff. But it is NOT time to begin being stampeded into something we'll regret, e.g., supporting Bloomberg over all other candidates.
If I am wrong - and I'm pretty sure that I will not be - and Bernie IS the Dem nominee, I'm afraid that I must follow my own advice. But I'm quite confident that will not have to happen.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ProfessorPlum
(11,257 posts)and Sanders represents a lot of change for the better. He will have wide support from progressives and independents.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)Not.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
thesquanderer
(11,986 posts)At least that's what polls show so far. I'll be keeping an eye on the polls as my own primary day gets closer.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Botany
(70,504 posts)... in the general election in a landslide. Again I hope I am wrong about all of this.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Gothmog
(145,231 posts)I agree with this part of the endorsement
Link to tweet
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
gopiscrap
(23,760 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
lees1975
(3,859 posts)Chris Hayes and MSNBC report that Bernie has the widest lead over Trump head to head at 51-43 along with Bloomberg.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Polybius
(15,411 posts)He's supposed to be our backup choice.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Botany
(70,504 posts)When did I sign up with your group?
Bernie as the nominee is a kamikaze mission. Now the shot of sake, speeders, and
beautiful girls waving as the plane takes off might make you feel good but at the end
of the day you will be dead. See post 220.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
mchill
(1,018 posts)One of the arguments for M4allthose insurance companies can take that away.
Guess what? Bernie wants to do just that. Take it away.
Oh the irony.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Gothmog
(145,231 posts)Link to tweet
?s=20
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Botany
(70,504 posts)Yes, fracking is dirty, it pollutes, natural gas when burned produces greenhouse gases,
but it employees and or pays tons of people in NY, PA, WV, MD, VA, KY, IL, & IN and they
all would vote against Bernie.
With Bernie @ the top of ticket even with the biggest crook in American History running
against him we would get slaughtered.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Gothmog
(145,231 posts)Link to tweet
?s=20
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
dalton99a
(81,486 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Gothmog
(145,231 posts)Link to tweet
?s=20
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden