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Joe BidenCongratulations to our presumptive Democratic nominee, Joe Biden!
 

brooklynite

(93,626 posts)
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 06:57 AM Apr 2019

My first impression: Biden is on the wrong track already...

His campaign announcement about Charlottesville and the moral condition represented by Trump is a stirring message..but it’s not HIS message. Biden has never been a civil rights messenger. Yes, he’s good at standing up to bullies, but that comes later. His raison d’etre is that he’s the candidate who’s supposed to appeal to the working class guy in Scranton, and that should have been the focus. We won the 2018 election on the beasts of economic arguments, and that wasn’t mentioned at all.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
172 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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My first impression: Biden is on the wrong track already... (Original Post) brooklynite Apr 2019 OP
Wasnt just civil rights MFM008 Apr 2019 #1
Perhaps, but I don't see that as a message that resonates with his voting base brooklynite Apr 2019 #2
That won't resonate with black women? Yeah OK. nt UniteFightBack Apr 2019 #18
Message auto-removed Name removed Apr 2019 #46
I'm OK with reality! nt UniteFightBack Apr 2019 #48
Women, primarily black women are the base of the Democratic party mcar Apr 2019 #49
+1. nt tblue37 Apr 2019 #84
Majority of white women vote Republican Kaleva Apr 2019 #95
So true, I am thankful for their presence and saidsimplesimon Apr 2019 #105
+10 Raster Apr 2019 #151
Yes! mcar Apr 2019 #152
Oh HELL YES!!! Raster Apr 2019 #153
So you think that white, non-hispanic voters won't vote for a POC for POTUS? ehrnst Apr 2019 #50
Sanders voted for the crime bill. Demsrule86 Apr 2019 #101
Does that mean Biden didn't? shanny Apr 2019 #116
No but if that is disqualifying for Biden same is true for Sanders. Demsrule86 Apr 2019 #142
no argument shanny Apr 2019 #145
Brooklynite, he spoke of America's CORE PRINCIPLES Hortensis Apr 2019 #66
He should have paraphrased that quotation rusty fender Apr 2019 #127
Ok, But I quoted as written assuming everyone Hortensis Apr 2019 #132
I know that's what you quoted rusty fender Apr 2019 #134
Some are just that way. No doubt hard on them, Hortensis Apr 2019 #138
Gold Bond, Aquaphor rusty fender Apr 2019 #139
I was just thinking that this has to be an irritating Hortensis Apr 2019 #140
Thank You for your Cha Apr 2019 #157
Agree it was a True Blue American Apr 2019 #27
Post removed Post removed Apr 2019 #40
An Appeal True Blue American Apr 2019 #44
why are you attacking Beto ? Biden is fine , no need for the ugly attacks on Beto JI7 Apr 2019 #45
Message auto-removed Name removed Apr 2019 #51
calling him a clown and criminal is an attack JI7 Apr 2019 #57
You called Beto a fraud, a criminal, and a clown, lapucelle Apr 2019 #60
Did he take his coffee on the way out? defacto7 Apr 2019 #141
I should have given him the whole box of donuts. lapucelle Apr 2019 #144
Silly. Remember when people thought the roll out of Hillary's logo boston bean Apr 2019 #3
Didn't say it was the end...but it raises flags for me... brooklynite Apr 2019 #4
Everything he said was the truth. I have no problem with it. boston bean Apr 2019 #5
Message auto-removed Name removed Apr 2019 #13
. TexasTowelie Apr 2019 #16
... BlueFlorida Apr 2019 #38
I thought it True Blue American Apr 2019 #29
What was your second impression? George II Apr 2019 #6
I didn't know he did impressions? still_one Apr 2019 #22
still-one, That was SO BAD, Lefta Dissenter Apr 2019 #64
LOL. I know. I couldn't help myself still_one Apr 2019 #73
Actually your comeback was far far better!!!!!!! still_one Apr 2019 #128
+1 LongtimeAZDem Apr 2019 #115
he has to win the democratic primary first and that's won through appealing JI7 Apr 2019 #7
Yeah, there is definitely a lot of weirdness around this. WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2019 #8
No. that's your opinion. Cha Apr 2019 #10
Maybe other people love weirdness. WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2019 #12
Maybe you just have Cha Apr 2019 #15
Yep n/t Bradshaw3 Apr 2019 #97
I am one of them. True Blue American Apr 2019 #31
Yes there certainly is *ahem ahem* nt UniteFightBack Apr 2019 #19
Why use the word "weird?" watoos Apr 2019 #24
I dunno. Is it? WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2019 #58
Yeah get that agesist shot in there Bradshaw3 Apr 2019 #99
Good call, I'll use "experienced" from now on. Thanks for the check. WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2019 #106
What's wrong with the timing, it seems pretty good to me. George II Apr 2019 #125
It appears to have been very effective PatSeg Apr 2019 #135
I didn't see Biden's message as a Civil Rights message. democrank Apr 2019 #9
Yes. Cha Apr 2019 #11
yes JI7 Apr 2019 #14
Exactly. nt cwydro Apr 2019 #59
I think you are really off base here. This is for the SOUL OF AMERICA. nt UniteFightBack Apr 2019 #17
+1! Cha Apr 2019 #21
I disagree. This is a non-issue. If this is the most pressing issue facing Biden, then he will still_one Apr 2019 #20
This has always been Biden's message. ucrdem Apr 2019 #23
I loved it, ucr.. Cha Apr 2019 #25
I think he's off to a great start ucrdem Apr 2019 #30
Yes, he had a peaceful Cha Apr 2019 #34
Same here! True Blue American Apr 2019 #35
Taking the heart and soul of America Cha Apr 2019 #148
Moi aussi! Mme. Defarge Apr 2019 #86
Oui, Mme Defarge! Cha Apr 2019 #149
You couldn't be more wrong. WeekiWater Apr 2019 #26
Thank You, Weeki! Cha Apr 2019 #33
1000+ True Blue American Apr 2019 #41
This. cwydro Apr 2019 #100
His policies won't mean shit, watoos Apr 2019 #28
I think 2018 was won largely because decent people of both parties or no party are appalled by Trump femmedem Apr 2019 #32
I've been clear about this before: our winning candidates said that voters did NOT feel that brooklynite Apr 2019 #39
By Jove! I think you've got it. Citizen53186 Apr 2019 #83
Since tRump will most likely be on the ballot in 2020 Bradshaw3 Apr 2019 #102
It is a reelection...so I disagree. Trump must be held to account. Demsrule86 Apr 2019 #103
Yes,it was. Reminding us of what our Country stands for. True Blue American Apr 2019 #150
Joe's going after American's with a sense of decency. Just like Obama would have, I'm good. dem4decades Apr 2019 #36
Perhaps you should take a meeting with him BlueFlorida Apr 2019 #37
Ad hominem attacks certainly wouldn't be part of the discussion... brooklynite Apr 2019 #53
I disagree Gothmog Apr 2019 #42
I just watched it and it made me tear up. madaboutharry Apr 2019 #43
I disagree, completely. spicysista Apr 2019 #47
lol ... stonecutter357 Apr 2019 #52
I just watched it and disagree mcar Apr 2019 #54
Somehow I'm guessing that Biden is not one of the cwydro Apr 2019 #55
First impressions can't always be trusted. ariadne0614 Apr 2019 #56
As a heterosexual old white man with problematic past mistakes, I salute rzemanfl Apr 2019 #75
Glad to see Joe confront white supremacy which is the central theme of the GOP dalton99a Apr 2019 #61
Me, too. (nt) ehrnst Apr 2019 #63
+1 ariadne0614 Apr 2019 #71
I wasn't aware that only one candidate can 'own' a civil rights message. ehrnst Apr 2019 #62
+++ plus over the next 10-12 years they need to get a new code word . Working class is already lunasun Apr 2019 #119
Disagree completely. Biden's announcement could not have been better. highplainsdem Apr 2019 #65
We tried to point out how bad Trump was in 2016 and it did not helpisontheway Apr 2019 #67
I'm sorry but your response made me giggle. watoos Apr 2019 #74
We have had 2+ years of him. boston bean Apr 2019 #76
I think Biden may go the way of Lieberman in 04. liberalnarb Apr 2019 #68
Yeah ok... he will beat Sander so there is that. Demsrule86 Apr 2019 #104
We shall see. liberalnarb Apr 2019 #123
Not really...New Hampshire shouldn't be In play. Demsrule86 Apr 2019 #133
Hmmm lunasun Apr 2019 #69
I didn't WANT it to go any way... brooklynite Apr 2019 #78
Focus on civil tights? That's not how it hit me. redstateblues Apr 2019 #87
Point to how I've been "anti-Biden". brooklynite Apr 2019 #89
How did the meeting go? n/t Laelth Apr 2019 #156
I didn't see it as a message about civil rights, so it would be hard for me to argue that slant lunasun Apr 2019 #91
Right on! True Blue American Apr 2019 #126
Against the Trumpian backdrop, Biden's act of sanity nearly seems deviant... Eyeball_Kid Apr 2019 #70
Its probably strategic. He may think he needs to appeal to black voters and to the left mr_liberal Apr 2019 #72
A fatal flaw of the Clinton campaign was assuming she had her base voters banked... brooklynite Apr 2019 #109
Instead they went with "Never Forget". It works for me. LongtimeAZDem Apr 2019 #117
did we watch the same ad???? samnsara Apr 2019 #77
For this thread Gothmog Apr 2019 #79
Joe stopped that one dead in its tracks this morning. nolabear Apr 2019 #147
Inspiring northoftheborder Apr 2019 #80
Gerard today snowybirdie Apr 2019 #81
He's not running in the general election... zaj Apr 2019 #82
It's a national emergency (stupid)! Mme. Defarge Apr 2019 #85
You've nailed it. Thank you for clarity of purpose. WheelWalker Apr 2019 #112
Money is the message. Prosper Apr 2019 #88
well said Locrian Apr 2019 #108
IMO voters who want to increase coal production, force tariffs etc. in hopes of personal $$ benefit lunasun Apr 2019 #113
Slogan Prosper Apr 2019 #136
The issue that got the votes for Hillary was economic. ehrnst Apr 2019 #154
2016 Prosper Apr 2019 #155
Do you have statistics that Hillary didn't get the majority of votes on economic anxiety? (nt) ehrnst Apr 2019 #160
Economic votes Prosper Apr 2019 #162
So that's a "no" on having data that supports your claims? ehrnst Apr 2019 #163
Exit polling??? Prosper Apr 2019 #164
So, you still have no data to back up your claim? ehrnst Apr 2019 #165
Trump won because Prosper Apr 2019 #166
That's not data that supports your claim about voters ehrnst Apr 2019 #167
Of course I own that Prosper Apr 2019 #168
I provided data to back up my claim, you did not. ehrnst Apr 2019 #169
Trump voters. Prosper Apr 2019 #170
As I said, I'm going on data from sources that I know have more expertise than I do. ehrnst Apr 2019 #171
Got it. Prosper Apr 2019 #172
I loved it. Demsrule86 Apr 2019 #90
this is the beginning and it was a fine way to start. beachbum bob Apr 2019 #92
My first impression: Your first impression seems off to me. MineralMan Apr 2019 #93
This. nt OhZone Apr 2019 #94
Fighting white supremacy head on should be ALL the candidates' message. Drunken Irishman Apr 2019 #96
Great opening message! Bradshaw3 Apr 2019 #98
Biden's message is "This Is The Greatest Country In The World IF We Stand For Our Ideals" writes3000 Apr 2019 #107
Thankfully, you'll be posting negatives editorials on him... LanternWaste Apr 2019 #110
I see: we now have to provide evidence when we state opinions...good to know! brooklynite Apr 2019 #114
The most important issue today is the battle for the soul of America. Joe is damn straight. WheelWalker Apr 2019 #111
I agree 100%. The soul of America and "it's the country, stupid." Kahuna7 Apr 2019 #118
I stole it from DUer Mme. Defarge... WheelWalker Apr 2019 #137
Absolutely disagree peggysue2 Apr 2019 #120
Trump's racism is unacceptable. Trump wasn't president for all of Joe's life. This is a crisis. themaguffin Apr 2019 #121
Lol. MrsCoffee Apr 2019 #122
Strong civil rights supporter emmaverybo Apr 2019 #124
He's no Hickenlooper BeyondGeography Apr 2019 #129
Washington Post-Analysis: For Joe Biden, Charlottesville defines the Trump presidency Gothmog Apr 2019 #130
You don't have to be an activist to see what a historically divisive event Charlottesville was. DemocratSinceBirth Apr 2019 #131
Nah, you couldn't be more off. brush Apr 2019 #143
Really? emmaverybo Apr 2019 #146
WAIT for it. Give the man a chance. Too many issues in one message is not helpful. sarabelle Apr 2019 #158
Trump needs to be challenged at every step Mr Tibbs Apr 2019 #159
Joe is on the right track and woke-domestic terrorism is out of control. New leadership is needed... Skya Rhen Apr 2019 #161
 

MFM008

(19,763 posts)
1. Wasnt just civil rights
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 06:59 AM
Apr 2019

It was sanity.
Decency.
Rule of law as well.
All things maggot lacks.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

brooklynite

(93,626 posts)
2. Perhaps, but I don't see that as a message that resonates with his voting base
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:02 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

UniteFightBack

(8,231 posts)
18. That won't resonate with black women? Yeah OK. nt
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:27 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

Response to UniteFightBack (Reply #18)

 

mcar

(42,179 posts)
49. Women, primarily black women are the base of the Democratic party
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 08:15 AM
Apr 2019

And our most faithful voting bloc.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Kaleva

(36,093 posts)
95. Majority of white women vote Republican
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 11:08 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

saidsimplesimon

(7,888 posts)
105. So true, I am thankful for their presence and
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 11:30 AM
Apr 2019

powerful voices.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Raster

(20,996 posts)
151. +10
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 05:20 PM
Apr 2019

It was women of color that first saw through tRump* and his con-job bullshit, and it is women of color that continue to beat back the insanity.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

mcar

(42,179 posts)
152. Yes!
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 05:23 PM
Apr 2019

And I salute, support, and stand with them.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Raster

(20,996 posts)
153. Oh HELL YES!!!
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 05:34 PM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

ehrnst

(32,640 posts)
50. So you think that white, non-hispanic voters won't vote for a POC for POTUS?
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 08:20 AM
Apr 2019

2008
2012

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Demsrule86

(68,217 posts)
101. Sanders voted for the crime bill.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 11:28 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

shanny

(6,709 posts)
116. Does that mean Biden didn't?
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 12:11 PM
Apr 2019

Two wrongs. eom

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Demsrule86

(68,217 posts)
142. No but if that is disqualifying for Biden same is true for Sanders.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 02:32 PM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
66. Brooklynite, he spoke of America's CORE PRINCIPLES
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 08:56 AM
Apr 2019

and that we are in a "battle for the soul of this nation. The core values of this nation, our standing in the world, our very democracy, everything that has made America, America, is at stake."

Your OP shows that you missed it. All other campaign issues, including the one you assign him, are secondary to and dependent on committing to our principles and winning this battle.

"We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights."


Joe quoting our nation's intensely liberal mission statement, the Declaration of Independence. For nearly 250 years many strong conservatives have disagreed and sought to eliminate these beliefs from not just our nation's laws but from our national character.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

rusty fender

(3,428 posts)
127. He should have paraphrased that quotation
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 01:14 PM
Apr 2019

as all people are created equal

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
132. Ok, But I quoted as written assuming everyone
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 01:30 PM
Apr 2019

Understands what is meant, and how it has been interpreted under our laws for several decades now, implicitly right down to their bones.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

rusty fender

(3,428 posts)
134. I know that's what you quoted
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 01:37 PM
Apr 2019

because that’s an exact quotation from the Declaration of Independence. But my contention is that the focus on “men” still rubs many women the wrong way.

In a paraphrase of the quotation using “people,” Biden could have shown that he is for universal equality.

It still rubs me the wrong way

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
138. Some are just that way. No doubt hard on them,
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 02:09 PM
Apr 2019

but there are medications and counseling, also soothing creams, to help if it wears them too raw. I like that our society doesn't actually need the slightest paraphrasing for it to mean it does. I'm also a great admirer of Jefferson. It was and still is a magnificent document.

Back to the war for our nation's soul, Democrats believe in and have always protected a living, flexible constitution that develops and advances as society does. That's one of the very biggest principles we must defend against the barbarians.

When we worry about conservative majorities on SCOTUS and Biden speaks of the soul of America, it's because they are within sight of beginning the reversal of nearly 250 years of liberalism, very much including re-interpretation of our constitution to eliminate liberalism and progressivism from our legal systems and other government institutions.

Keep your eyes on the prize, Rusty.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

rusty fender

(3,428 posts)
139. Gold Bond, Aquaphor
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 02:15 PM
Apr 2019
Good one, Hortensis!

No doubt about keeping my eye on the prize. It’s no secret that I dislike Biden. He is very close to being my last choice among the Democrats who are running, but I wii absolutely vote for him if he is our nominee
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
140. I was just thinking that this has to be an irritating
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 02:29 PM
Apr 2019

day for those who really want to move on from the Bidens, etc. Completely understandable.

Fwiw, Biden is part of today's modern world when it comes to the VP role, no longer the worst job in the world but developing into a very important one. At least for Democratic VPs.

The Republican Party's becoming even more hierarchal and authoritarian than before, a good trick.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,519 posts)
157. Thank You for your
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 04:46 AM
Apr 2019

post, Hortensis.

Yes, the OP missed it.. but Thank Goodness so many got it.

It was heart and soul searing to me.. not about civil rights per se.. but about all human rights that are being slowly but determinately taken away.

Biden took it straight to the eye of the Psycho, and leaves zero doubt what he intends to do to Trump during the next 18 months. Outstanding!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

True Blue American

(17,968 posts)
27. Agree it was a
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:37 AM
Apr 2019

Great first message. Sanity among hate and chaos.

Suited me fine.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

Response to True Blue American (Reply #27)

 

True Blue American

(17,968 posts)
44. An Appeal
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:57 AM
Apr 2019

To our better nature. Something that is missing in Trump, his followers and the Republicans who are afraid to stand up.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

JI7

(89,150 posts)
45. why are you attacking Beto ? Biden is fine , no need for the ugly attacks on Beto
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 08:00 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

Response to JI7 (Reply #45)

 

JI7

(89,150 posts)
57. calling him a clown and criminal is an attack
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 08:28 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

lapucelle

(18,016 posts)
60. You called Beto a fraud, a criminal, and a clown,
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 08:31 AM
Apr 2019

but you didn't mean it as an attack?

Welcome to DU.

Have a donut.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

defacto7

(13,485 posts)
141. Did he take his coffee on the way out?
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 02:32 PM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

lapucelle

(18,016 posts)
144. I should have given him the whole box of donuts.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 02:33 PM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

boston bean

(36,181 posts)
3. Silly. Remember when people thought the roll out of Hillary's logo
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:02 AM
Apr 2019

Was the end of her campaign?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

brooklynite

(93,626 posts)
4. Didn't say it was the end...but it raises flags for me...
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:04 AM
Apr 2019

The video makes it clear that there WAS an intent to kick off in Charlottesville, which got them into trouble.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

boston bean

(36,181 posts)
5. Everything he said was the truth. I have no problem with it.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:06 AM
Apr 2019

And he should have been able to open his campaign in Charlottesville as far as I am concerned.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

Response to boston bean (Reply #5)

 

True Blue American

(17,968 posts)
29. I thought it
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:39 AM
Apr 2019

Was against the rules to bad mouth Democrats.

Why do you feel it necessary to top post this? Your opinion,only.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

George II

(67,782 posts)
6. What was your second impression?
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:06 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

still_one

(91,807 posts)
22. I didn't know he did impressions?
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:30 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Lefta Dissenter

(6,616 posts)
64. still-one, That was SO BAD,
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 08:50 AM
Apr 2019

my neighbors called 911 when they heard me groan. They were sure I was dying.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

still_one

(91,807 posts)
73. LOL. I know. I couldn't help myself
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 09:16 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

still_one

(91,807 posts)
128. Actually your comeback was far far better!!!!!!!
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 01:21 PM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

JI7

(89,150 posts)
7. he has to win the democratic primary first and that's won through appealing
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:07 AM
Apr 2019

to people who feel civil rights is a top issue.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

WhiskeyGrinder

(22,094 posts)
8. Yeah, there is definitely a lot of weirdness around this.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:09 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Cha

(295,519 posts)
10. No. that's your opinion.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:12 AM
Apr 2019

I've seen too many others who loved it.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

WhiskeyGrinder

(22,094 posts)
12. Maybe other people love weirdness.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:15 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Cha

(295,519 posts)
15. Maybe you just have
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:18 AM
Apr 2019

insults.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

True Blue American

(17,968 posts)
31. I am one of them.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:40 AM
Apr 2019

I see sour grapes in this thread.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

UniteFightBack

(8,231 posts)
19. Yes there certainly is *ahem ahem* nt
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:28 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

watoos

(7,142 posts)
24. Why use the word "weird?"
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:34 AM
Apr 2019

Isn't that basically how Trump describes Joe?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

WhiskeyGrinder

(22,094 posts)
58. I dunno. Is it?
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 08:28 AM
Apr 2019

I used it because the confusion over timing, location and message before it came out didn't speak well to an old hand's rollout.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Bradshaw3

(7,448 posts)
99. Yeah get that agesist shot in there
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 11:25 AM
Apr 2019

Along with a lot of presumptions about the rollout that you don't know for sure.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

WhiskeyGrinder

(22,094 posts)
106. Good call, I'll use "experienced" from now on. Thanks for the check.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 11:33 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

George II

(67,782 posts)
125. What's wrong with the timing, it seems pretty good to me.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 12:58 PM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

PatSeg

(46,559 posts)
135. It appears to have been very effective
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 01:46 PM
Apr 2019

and Joe is dominating the news cycle. Most reactions have been very positive. It is only the first official step, there will be much more to follow. I think it speaks very well for a seasoned and experienced politician.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

democrank

(11,032 posts)
9. I didn't see Biden's message as a Civil Rights message.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:12 AM
Apr 2019

I saw it as a statement about our choice of what kind of nation we are.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

UniteFightBack

(8,231 posts)
17. I think you are really off base here. This is for the SOUL OF AMERICA. nt
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:25 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

still_one

(91,807 posts)
20. I disagree. This is a non-issue. If this is the most pressing issue facing Biden, then he will
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:29 AM
Apr 2019

have a very smooth road ahead.

The fact is though, there will be other issues brought up, and it is those issues that will be the challenge. This isn't one of them


If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

ucrdem

(15,512 posts)
23. This has always been Biden's message.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:33 AM
Apr 2019

The beauty of it is he doesn't need to dog whistle to get his base out.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,519 posts)
25. I loved it, ucr..
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:35 AM
Apr 2019

It went right to the heart and soul of America.. where it should be.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

ucrdem

(15,512 posts)
30. I think he's off to a great start
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:39 AM
Apr 2019

and that's a VERY good thing!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,519 posts)
34. Yes, he had a peaceful
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:45 AM
Apr 2019

calming effect.. our elder statesman And, he looked good, too!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

True Blue American

(17,968 posts)
35. Same here!
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:45 AM
Apr 2019

I will be watching that clip over and over. You can bet the media will.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,519 posts)
148. Taking the heart and soul of America
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 04:47 PM
Apr 2019

right to trump's door was perfect, True Blue American!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,519 posts)
149. Oui, Mme Defarge!
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 04:49 PM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

WeekiWater

(3,259 posts)
26. You couldn't be more wrong.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:37 AM
Apr 2019

You are so over the top wrong that it just seems strange. You clearly have zero clue about the Violence Against Women’s Act, the work of the Biden Foundation, and his career as a whole.

His message was about an idea that encompasses more than your shortsighted view. But you knew that before you hit post.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,519 posts)
33. Thank You, Weeki!
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:41 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

watoos

(7,142 posts)
28. His policies won't mean shit,
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:37 AM
Apr 2019

if he doesn't first and foremost take on Trump toe to toe. Our candidate needs to be as tough as nails, if he/she is not it doesn't matter what their policies are if they can't knock Trump right on his fat azz.

Joe did just fine.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

femmedem

(8,185 posts)
32. I think 2018 was won largely because decent people of both parties or no party are appalled by Trump
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:41 AM
Apr 2019

This messaging isn't just about civil rights; it's about core decency which is very much part of Biden's appeal.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

brooklynite

(93,626 posts)
39. I've been clear about this before: our winning candidates said that voters did NOT feel that
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:53 AM
Apr 2019

Voters didn't want to talk about Trump; they wanted to talk about jove, healthcare, education costs and other economic issues.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Citizen53186

(1 post)
83. By Jove! I think you've got it.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 10:09 AM
Apr 2019

Sorry, couldn't resist.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Bradshaw3

(7,448 posts)
102. Since tRump will most likely be on the ballot in 2020
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 11:28 AM
Apr 2019

Voters will be talking about him.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Demsrule86

(68,217 posts)
103. It is a reelection...so I disagree. Trump must be held to account.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 11:29 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

True Blue American

(17,968 posts)
150. Yes,it was. Reminding us of what our Country stands for.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 05:11 PM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

dem4decades

(11,208 posts)
36. Joe's going after American's with a sense of decency. Just like Obama would have, I'm good.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:47 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

BlueFlorida

(1,532 posts)
37. Perhaps you should take a meeting with him
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:47 AM
Apr 2019

and make him change his ways with your erudite, perspicacious and prescient wisdom.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

brooklynite

(93,626 posts)
53. Ad hominem attacks certainly wouldn't be part of the discussion...
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 08:23 AM
Apr 2019

Perhaps you could try to respond to my points as other were able to.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(143,633 posts)
42. I disagree
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:56 AM
Apr 2019

Joe is our best candidate

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

madaboutharry

(40,137 posts)
43. I just watched it and it made me tear up.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 07:57 AM
Apr 2019

I was very moved by his announcement. I thought it was great.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

spicysista

(1,663 posts)
47. I disagree, completely.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 08:07 AM
Apr 2019

I think you may not have a clear view of whom comprises Uncle Joe's base. Sure, it's Pennsylvanians and the folks of Michigan. It's also women of color, too. All of these folks will find a message about decency appealing.

I did not get "civil rights" from his video. Instead, I heard an urgent call for civility. I felt emotional call for us return to the ideals that we all typically share. "Haven't we wallowed in this nastiness long enough," (not a quote, just a summation of his message, to me).

This was a call to the folks who stayed home, not thinking Dolt45 would be this terrible. It's also a call to arms of the gate keepers and institutions of our society.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

mcar

(42,179 posts)
54. I just watched it and disagree
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 08:24 AM
Apr 2019

Charlottesville was a crystallizing moment in our history and shouldn't be forgotten or buried under the load of scandal. We are better than that. Joe is reminding us.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

cwydro

(51,308 posts)
55. Somehow I'm guessing that Biden is not one of the
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 08:27 AM
Apr 2019

“prominent” Dems you like to post about having lunch with.

Call it a wild guess.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

ariadne0614

(1,679 posts)
56. First impressions can't always be trusted.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 08:27 AM
Apr 2019

Sometimes they reveal more about our own limitations than anything else. I’m not a working guy from Scranton, but I’ll venture a guess that Joe doesn’t need to prove himself to working guys. By now, the fact that he’s “one of them” goes without saying. Why would he want to stay on that narrow track at this point?

My list of worthy candidates is still long, and so far none of them are heterosexual old white men with problematic past mistakes. That said, I was stirred by Joe Biden’s words. If he can open the hearts and minds of working guys in Scranton to include the rest of us in their vision of America, I’m glad he’s in.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

rzemanfl

(29,523 posts)
75. As a heterosexual old white man with problematic past mistakes, I salute
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 09:30 AM
Apr 2019

you.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

dalton99a

(80,906 posts)
61. Glad to see Joe confront white supremacy which is the central theme of the GOP
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 08:40 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

ehrnst

(32,640 posts)
62. I wasn't aware that only one candidate can 'own' a civil rights message.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 08:48 AM
Apr 2019

I thought all Democratic candidates are supposed to be beating that drum in this age of the rise of White Supremacy.

I guess "working guy in Scranton" doesn't include "working man/woman of color in Scranton?"



And if indeed he already has the WHITE MALE voter appeal, wouldn't it be a wise strategy to make it a point to demonstrate to POC that he prioritizes them and the dangers confronting them as much as he does the "white working guy in Scranton?"

Perhaps you are not his intended audience. White men are often baffled when their POV is not the one represented front and center.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

lunasun

(21,646 posts)
119. +++ plus over the next 10-12 years they need to get a new code word . Working class is already
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 12:14 PM
Apr 2019

1/2 womenz and by 2030 will be a majority of non white workers

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

highplainsdem

(48,650 posts)
65. Disagree completely. Biden's announcement could not have been better.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 08:53 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

helpisontheway

(5,002 posts)
67. We tried to point out how bad Trump was in 2016 and it did not
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 09:01 AM
Apr 2019

work. They don’t care. He should have focused on an economic message.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

watoos

(7,142 posts)
74. I'm sorry but your response made me giggle.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 09:29 AM
Apr 2019

We won in 2018 because the American people want a check on Donald Trump, want Trump to be held accountable.

Yeah, Joe could have said the stock market is booming because Trump artificially inflated it by giving the rich and corporations 1.5 trillion dollars and tax breaks that never expire.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

boston bean

(36,181 posts)
76. We have had 2+ years of him.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 09:32 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

liberalnarb

(4,532 posts)
68. I think Biden may go the way of Lieberman in 04.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 09:06 AM
Apr 2019

Thats how I feel this might play out.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Demsrule86

(68,217 posts)
104. Yeah ok... he will beat Sander so there is that.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 11:30 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

liberalnarb

(4,532 posts)
123. We shall see.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 12:45 PM
Apr 2019

They are neck and neck.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Demsrule86

(68,217 posts)
133. Not really...New Hampshire shouldn't be In play.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 01:32 PM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

lunasun

(21,646 posts)
69. Hmmm
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 09:08 AM
Apr 2019

Oh well didn’t go the way you wanted.
Isn’t the message you wanted him to focus on - white working class -economics basically Sanders / Pete B ‘ s niche?
Glad his announcement had a bigger message for all that this is America, but everyone will react different to that message
That’s not how I interpreted 2018 wins - all about economic issues again other people will see it different
I’m glad he sees past division as a win and $$ to the heart and soul of the country being assaulted everyday trump sits in the WH

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

brooklynite

(93,626 posts)
78. I didn't WANT it to go any way...
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 09:33 AM
Apr 2019

He's not my candidate at this point, so I'm assessing his prospects dispassionately. Yes it's true that Sanders, Buttigieg are Ryan are going after the working class voter (Sanders without the geographic targeting) but it's still Biden's natural constituency. You could just as easily argue that he shouldn't focus on civil rights since Harris, Booker and Castro are targeting those issues as well.

As for the 2018 election results: this isn't my "interpretation". This is what the many candidates I talked to told me was on the minds of the voters.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

redstateblues

(10,565 posts)
87. Focus on civil tights? That's not how it hit me.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 10:17 AM
Apr 2019

Knowing how anti Biden you have been it’s not surprising that you had a negative reaction. I’m sure it’s frustrating that your candidate’s campaign isn’t getting any traction

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

brooklynite

(93,626 posts)
89. Point to how I've been "anti-Biden".
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 10:29 AM
Apr 2019

As for Hickenlooper, I've said before I don't get emotionally invested in my candidates, and I'll happily replace him if a better candidate comes along. I had lunch yesterday with Kamala Harris' campaign manager and was impressed enough to give her another look. And I'll be meeting with Amy Klobuchar this evening.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Laelth

(32,017 posts)
156. How did the meeting go? n/t
Sat Apr 27, 2019, 02:19 PM
Apr 2019

-Laelth

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

lunasun

(21,646 posts)
91. I didn't see it as a message about civil rights, so it would be hard for me to argue that slant
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 10:32 AM
Apr 2019

The focus imo was about the state of the nation
"We are in the battle for the soul of this nation," Biden said.

That message can speak to all Americans concerned.

Imo that would appeal to and include white working class who are concerned about what has happened under trump just like it would appeal to many others of different class or color.

It should speak to those of that target group who have an understanding of who we are as a whole in America
But I don’t know if it will
Everyone hears something different from a candidate even though it’s the same speech and will react differently to the same images in a video.
If all that target group sees is an over emphasis on civil rights from Biden’s announcement so be it , there are other candidates for them

Time will tell if his is a winning campaign strategy that can unite


If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Eyeball_Kid

(7,398 posts)
70. Against the Trumpian backdrop, Biden's act of sanity nearly seems deviant...
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 09:09 AM
Apr 2019

but normality is refreshing. There's nothing that Biden said that's out of the realm of normal political rhetoric. Biden is more like a normal politician who's been around so long, he's like dandelions in the front lawn. But he's showing bright, optimistic colors. That's important for the body politic to absorb. He's not so much "Uncle Joe" as he is "Grandpa Joe." But a strong segment of the voting public will show an appreciation for an old face, and old voice. There's nothing wrong with that. He will generate more relief than excitement. Others in the race, where the new talent reside, are more prone to ignite a movement. But movement or not, the sanity argument may end up being the single most important factor in opposing The Monster.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

mr_liberal

(1,017 posts)
72. Its probably strategic. He may think he needs to appeal to black voters and to the left
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 09:12 AM
Apr 2019

for the primaries. The working class theme will be used for the GE. He has to get the nomination first though.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

brooklynite

(93,626 posts)
109. A fatal flaw of the Clinton campaign was assuming she had her base voters banked...
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 11:45 AM
Apr 2019

...before trying to expand the pool. Biden should start with with working class economics and expand from there.

Consider the following: Biden was seen taping video in Scranton, which obviously didn't make it into the final cut. They obviously thought that was a message target at one point.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LongtimeAZDem

(4,494 posts)
117. Instead they went with "Never Forget". It works for me.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 12:12 PM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

samnsara

(17,554 posts)
77. did we watch the same ad????
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 09:32 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

nolabear

(41,902 posts)
147. Joe stopped that one dead in its tracks this morning.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 03:47 PM
Apr 2019

That Fox guy never knew what hit him.

“Welcome to Delaware.”

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

northoftheborder

(7,565 posts)
80. Inspiring
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 09:47 AM
Apr 2019

Our core American values - strongly put - and contrasting, and challenging, directly with/to the creature in the WH. He can go into issues and platforms later, this was his introduction. I liked it, felt inspired, and I'm not a Biden Supporter yet. May be later. Still thinking and comparing. Too soon to choose, for me.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

snowybirdie

(5,174 posts)
81. Gerard today
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 09:55 AM
Apr 2019

that this is only one of the rollout. Next is a discussion about job loss in certain areas.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

zaj

(3,433 posts)
82. He's not running in the general election...
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 09:56 AM
Apr 2019

... right now. You want him to use his time to campaign to win the votes of the people he most likely has already? He's positioning himself to win the more liberal voters.

Seems a reasonable strategy.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Mme. Defarge

(7,973 posts)
85. It's a national emergency (stupid)!
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 10:11 AM
Apr 2019

I mean no disrespect to you. If these were normal times it would be the economy ...

Peace.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

WheelWalker

(8,940 posts)
112. You've nailed it. Thank you for clarity of purpose.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 11:52 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Prosper

(761 posts)
88. Money is the message.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 10:21 AM
Apr 2019

Trump won the election with "Lots of good paying jobs" and "Make America Great Again". Those voters are up for grabs because Trump failed in those promises. The winning message is "Good paying living wage job" and "Make America Fair for You and Your Kids". The other issues had those voters in 2016. Don't need to reinforce the issues that are already have won. Need to get the extra votes to win. Those are the voters that can't afford medicine or medical care or to send their kids to college. Trump deserted and disappointed them but he can lie them into voting for him again unless our candidate champions them. The voters that can determine the election are too busy trying to survive to analyze issues. Unless their problem of affording to live is the prime message they will "wait to see what happens" and be vulnerable to Trumps lies. Winning them has to overcome the guy that could:
Jan 24, 2016 · "I could stand in the middle of 5th Avenue and shoot somebody and I wouldn't lose voters," Trump said ..."
Forget about attacking or showing what a contradiction Trump is.
Our candidate has to promise to fulfill Trumps promises of lots of good paying jobs and make America Great Again. The voters that gave Trump the election had a heritage of lots of Good Paying Jobs in the 50s, 60s and start of the 70s. The poverty of the working poor was a choice made by the GOP . They passed every possible law to short circuit money from jobs producing investments into paper trading to huge stagnating reserves.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Locrian

(4,522 posts)
108. well said
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 11:43 AM
Apr 2019

feel good fuzzy feelings won't cut it

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

lunasun

(21,646 posts)
113. IMO voters who want to increase coal production, force tariffs etc. in hopes of personal $$ benefit
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 12:05 PM
Apr 2019

will not be interested in Biden
Other dem candidates will get some of those votes in a primary but plenty of voters will stick with trump and his way back machine
Sentimental wishes and unrealistic promises are not a good strategy to me but many voters hated that Clinton was realistic about where healthcare could go in one term and rejected Obamacare because Obama I guess, so there will always be those who will go after the carrot in front of them instead and trump has already promised super duper healthcare after 2020

I actually appreciated that Biden went beyond a wish " to go back in time " message to address concerns about America today, what is happening , the crossroads we are at, and America's future

I was hoping he would not draw primarily on a wish to return to the Obama years as a message and he did not

or like trump a fantasy of return to life 60 or more years ago

(which I think did not include healthcare for all or free college although Medicare / Mediaid and Pell grants were passed in that era, but that was all by democrats like Pell & LBJ moving it forward - maybe bring that up more often to trump voters instead-)

Plus do we really want to embrace trumps slogan?
https://abc.go.com/playlists/PL551614312/video/VDKA3429610




If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Prosper

(761 posts)
136. Slogan
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 01:52 PM
Apr 2019

"Plus do we really want to embrace trumps slogan?"
Trump had no problem embracing what should have been the Democratic Slogan and he won the election with it. Yes, take back our slogan.
Do you really want to win? The issue that will get the winning votes is economic. Middle class kids will face a lifetime of debt when graduating from college. Remember that over 45,000 people die each year from lack of medicine and health care. Those dying are in the families of the working poor. No excuse for working poor. Good paying jobs, free education and REALLY
affordable healthcare are salvation to the working class.
"trump and his way back machine" which was a lie. Nothing wrong with undoing fifty years of pro super wealthy legislation and turning back the clock to when opportunity was available to the working poor. What Trump addressed in 2016 were the issues suffering the working class. His message was correct and his message should have been the Democratic Message in 2016. He was correct in identifying the need for good paying jobs. The problem was he told boldfaced lies. He had no intention of creating good paying jobs because he wanted to keep USA wages low and competitive.

"Plus do we really want to embrace trumps slogan?" Absolutely, positively. And make a lot of noise about doing what Trump had no intention of doing. The only way to beat Trump is to praise the idea of good paying jobs and then follow up. Prosperity or poverty are choices of the legislature. Pass laws rewarding job producing investments and pass laws to penalize stagnating investments like derivatives. Prosperity is a function of spending. Spending is the expertise of the middle class. Give them higher paying jobs and they will spend more money. That translates into positive capitalism utilizing money to create prosperity.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

ehrnst

(32,640 posts)
154. The issue that got the votes for Hillary was economic.
Sat Apr 27, 2019, 01:19 PM
Apr 2019

Trump appealed to the culturally anxious voters.

Democrats have adcvocated for economic issues for decades.

Look at the historic plaforms...

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Prosper

(761 posts)
155. 2016
Sat Apr 27, 2019, 02:02 PM
Apr 2019

When Trump was calling for lots of good paying jobs Hillary was saying things are basically okay and just need some fine tuning. She said there were some disgruntled people looking at others doing well. But she started out 2015 defending Obama's record saying things were fine and just needed some fine tuning. She also said wages have been essentially stagnant for many years. Trouble is lots of those years were under Democratic presidents including her husband. The Democratic Party is historically the party of the working people. But underperformed is the problem . Those stagnant wages were and are still a problem. The nominee has to come out swinging for living wages .

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

ehrnst

(32,640 posts)
160. Do you have statistics that Hillary didn't get the majority of votes on economic anxiety? (nt)
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 08:59 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Prosper

(761 posts)
162. Economic votes
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 04:10 PM
Apr 2019

Hillary was supposed to obliterate Trump. She didn't get all the votes we were counting on. Hard to figure out but I know in my case I never even thought about it, just voted Hillary . I would suppose the votes she didn't get were the working poor. The people Trump targeted with "Lots of good paying jobs. I'll bet he doesn't get Wisconsin and Michigan this time. The only thing to worry about is the votes he got from the tax cut.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

ehrnst

(32,640 posts)
163. So that's a "no" on having data that supports your claims?
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 04:24 PM
Apr 2019

Because there is actual data that debunks the "Trump won on economic anxiety" claims you promote:

But exit-poll data showed that economics wasn’t the primary motivation for his base. States in which the vote was the closest saw those most worried about the economy voting for Hillary Clinton. What motivated Trump voters, it turned out, was his emphasis on immigration and terrorism. If “economic anxiety” was pushing Trump supporters to the polls, it seemed to manifest primarily as distrust of foreigners.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2018/09/17/democrats-express-more-economic-distress-than-republicans-including-among-whites/?utm_term=.a4b36c632498

Economic Anxiety Didn’t Elect Trump and It May Hurt His Party in the Midterms

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/10/opinion/trump-coalition-2016-midterms.html

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Prosper

(761 posts)
164. Exit polling???
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 07:34 PM
Apr 2019

So 11 days before the exit polls you are talking about the polls had Hillary winning. Eleven days after the polls couldn't have been more wrong you are citing exit polls as a source of factual information. Sorry, doesn't work. Besides that the reason people voted for Hillary is irrelevant. And the people that voted for Trump that were influenced by immigration and terrorism were never going to vote for Hillary. Hillary made promises for economic development but Trump won with the slogan "Lots of good paying jobs"

He said jobs were coming back': the Trump voters who feel cheated
The Guardian
how many people voted for trump because of promise of good paying jobs from amp.theguardian.com
Nov 4, 2018 · Donald Trump won the votes of many in middle America in 2016 by ... According to a report by Good Jobs Nation, the ... People are picking up and leaving

Like the polls people that didn't want to say they would support Trump would also remain silent in exit polls.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

ehrnst

(32,640 posts)
165. So, you still have no data to back up your claim?
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 07:47 PM
Apr 2019

Got it.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Prosper

(761 posts)
166. Trump won because
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 08:23 PM
Apr 2019

Rust Belt voters made Trump president. Now they want jobs
By Heather Long March 3, 2017: 7:26 AM ET
The United States is making more things than ever before.

Yes, you read that right. Manufacturing output is at an all-time high, according to one government statistic (others indicate it's near a record).


Donald Trump promised Michigan good jobs. It's a key reason why he won Michigan by 10,704 votes, the first Republican to carry the state since President George H. W. Bush in


And if we want to win in 2020 the slogan needs to be
""Lots of good paying jobs"
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

ehrnst

(32,640 posts)
167. That's not data that supports your claim about voters
Mon Apr 29, 2019, 07:11 AM
Apr 2019

voting for Trump because of economic anxiety, not cultural anxiety.

Data would be a study of voters.

Until you back up your claim, it's a personal opinion. That's fine, but you should just own that.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Prosper

(761 posts)
168. Of course I own that
Mon Apr 29, 2019, 08:42 AM
Apr 2019

And your data is no more valid. People were lying to pollsters just before the election. That certainly casts doubt on the exit polls. If people lied to pollsters over the phone then chances are they would lie in the open circumstances of the voting location. But far more important is what the platform to beat Trump should be. I am saying the prime motive is living wages. It is fact that middle class working wages have been stagnant for over 40 years. That and the cost of college and healthcare are the driving motives to be catered to in order to win. All the other issues are already locked in. Living wage addresses the problems of the working class.

Opinion | The 2016 Exit Polls Led Us to Misinterpret the 2016 Election
The New York Times
how valid were the 2016 exit polls from www.nytimes.com
Mar 29, 2018 · “The short answer is that the exit polls are wrong,” Matthew DeBell, a senior scholar at Stanford's Institute for ...

Ten Reasons Why You Should Ignore Exit Polls
FiveThirtyEight
how valid are exit polls from fivethirtyeight.com
Nov 4, 2008 · Oh, let me count the ways. Almost all of this, by the way, is lifted from Mark Bluemthnal's outstanding Exit Poll ...

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

ehrnst

(32,640 posts)
169. I provided data to back up my claim, you did not.
Mon Apr 29, 2019, 09:36 AM
Apr 2019

It's good to see that now you have acknowledged that your take was opinion and not a statement of fact, as it was first presented.

But here are some examples of more data that support the conclusion that Trump voters voted out of racial fears, and not for economic reasons.

Examining our data from the GenForward Survey, we find a hybrid explanation. First, white millennial Trump voters were likely to believe in something we call “white vulnerability” — the perception that whites, through no fault of their own, are losing ground to other groups. Second, racial resentment was the primary driver of white vulnerability — even when accounting for income, education level or employment.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2017/12/15/racial-resentment-is-why-41-percent-of-white-millennials-voted-for-trump-in-2016/


A study published on Monday in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences questions that explanation, the latest to suggest that Trump voters weren’t driven by anger over the past, but rather fear of what may come. White, Christian and male voters, the study suggests, turned to Mr. Trump because they felt their status was at risk.

“It’s much more of a symbolic threat that people feel,’’ said Diana C. Mutz, the author of the study and a political science and communications professor at the University of Pennsylvania, where she directs the Institute for the Study of Citizens and Politics. “It’s not a threat to their own economic well-being; it’s a threat to their group’s dominance in our country over all.”


https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/24/us/politics/trump-economic-anxiety.html


This new paper fits with a sizeable slate of studies conducted over the past 18 months or so, most of which have come to the same conclusions: There is tremendous evidence that Trump voters were motivated by racial resentment (as well as hostile sexism), and very little evidence that economic stress had anything to do with it.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/10/16/17980820/trump-obama-2016-race-racism-class-economy-2018-midterm
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Prosper

(761 posts)
170. Trump voters.
Mon Apr 29, 2019, 10:24 AM
Apr 2019

Said:
"But here are some examples of more data that support the conclusion that Trump voters voted out of racial fears, and not for economic reasons."

That is a generalization of all Trump voters. It doesn't address sub groups. It doesn't address the protest votes from Bernie supporters. It doesn't address the rust belt. The rust belt gave Trump the presidency. He promised "Lots of good paying jobs".

I think the only votes up for grabs are the rust belt states because Trump failed on his promise of good paying jobs. Those people and the Bernie or busters are the only Trump voters that can be won back.

Are you intimating there are other issues besides good paying jobs that will win 2020.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

ehrnst

(32,640 posts)
171. As I said, I'm going on data from sources that I know have more expertise than I do.
Mon Apr 29, 2019, 10:37 AM
Apr 2019

I know enough to know what I don't know.

Is that clearer?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

beachbum bob

(10,437 posts)
92. this is the beginning and it was a fine way to start.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 10:55 AM
Apr 2019

Biden will address ALL the issues and top is economic anxiety. A great term he used

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

MineralMan

(146,116 posts)
93. My first impression: Your first impression seems off to me.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 10:57 AM
Apr 2019

That is all.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Drunken Irishman

(34,857 posts)
96. Fighting white supremacy head on should be ALL the candidates' message.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 11:10 AM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Bradshaw3

(7,448 posts)
98. Great opening message!
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 11:23 AM
Apr 2019

We all know he has the policy and experience chops, and appeals to swing voters. He is setting his campaign theme right where it belongs: we have an existential threat to our democracy and basic ideals and he is putting that front and center.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

writes3000

(4,734 posts)
107. Biden's message is "This Is The Greatest Country In The World IF We Stand For Our Ideals"
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 11:36 AM
Apr 2019

It’s a powerful message which can encompass everything else including fair wages, affordable healthcare, etc...

Of course, it also frames Trump perfectly as well.

Joe’s video started with our constitution. I loved it.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
110. Thankfully, you'll be posting negatives editorials on him...
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 11:47 AM
Apr 2019

Thankfully, you'll be posting negatives editorials on him (as you've already begun doing) in between your name-dropping anecdotes about lunches.

Other than that, you've posted zero evidence supporting your quickly-reached conclusion...in grade school, that's called guess-work. You'll certainly allege it as something else.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

brooklynite

(93,626 posts)
114. I see: we now have to provide evidence when we state opinions...good to know!
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 12:08 PM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

WheelWalker

(8,940 posts)
111. The most important issue today is the battle for the soul of America. Joe is damn straight.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 11:51 AM
Apr 2019

"It's the Country, stupid"

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Kahuna7

(2,531 posts)
118. I agree 100%. The soul of America and "it's the country, stupid."
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 12:13 PM
Apr 2019

That's a pretty good slogan... Yours? If so,

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

peggysue2

(10,801 posts)
120. Absolutely disagree
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 12:27 PM
Apr 2019

We are--in this moment--engaged in battle for the heart and soul of this country. We're witnessing the damage done every day. I believe the vast majority of Americans are patriots, horrified with the daily assault on basic decency and American values. No progress on wages or inequality or job security is possible if we lose the country to the very goons who marched in Charlottesville.

Joe Biden will be talking to union members in Pittsburgh on Monday. I suspect that rally will be delivered in the same vein as the speech before the Electrical Workers Union several weeks ago, speaking directly to concerns of the working class but also to all America: we are better than this, bigger-hearted than this. We are America where possibility is unlimited. Yes, we have flaws and fault-lines but that's not what defines us as a people. We're a country who has done big things. We need to get back to that, remember who and what we are, not by shrinking into the corner but by stepping out, throwing our arms wide open to the future and the world.

Joe Biden can change the narrative bringing us back from the brink. And he can win in 2020.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

themaguffin

(3,787 posts)
121. Trump's racism is unacceptable. Trump wasn't president for all of Joe's life. This is a crisis.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 12:32 PM
Apr 2019

Joe's message was pitch perfect.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

emmaverybo

(8,144 posts)
124. Strong civil rights supporter
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 12:46 PM
Apr 2019

Do not know how any one could read his opening salvo as being anything else than support for all forms of civil rights. NAACP accorded his Voting record 100 percent supportivein 2006. In 2012, as VP, Biden addressed NAACP convention and was booed because he stopped the speech. His focus was on voting rights. Said Roslyn Brock the group’s chairwoman at the time, “He has been a lifelong friend to the NAACP. He has been a strong advocate for justice and equality over his decades of service in the Senate and the White House.” 50 percent of the audience gave him a standing ovation.
Throughout his long career, Biden has been open to change, for example, voting to give Bush authority to go into Iraq, but becoming an outspoken critic of that occupation.




If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

BeyondGeography

(39,226 posts)
129. He's no Hickenlooper
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 01:23 PM
Apr 2019

That's fer sure.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Gothmog

(143,633 posts)
130. Washington Post-Analysis: For Joe Biden, Charlottesville defines the Trump presidency
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 01:24 PM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

DemocratSinceBirth

(99,702 posts)
131. You don't have to be an activist to see what a historically divisive event Charlottesville was.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 01:25 PM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

brush

(53,331 posts)
143. Nah, you couldn't be more off.
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 02:33 PM
Apr 2019

lolololol.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

emmaverybo

(8,144 posts)
146. Really?
Thu Apr 25, 2019, 03:43 PM
Apr 2019

NAACP doesn’t agree with you. Obviously Carol Mosley Braun doesn’t agree with you. Seen Biden’s address to 2012 NAACP convention and its reception? Listened to what Obama said about him as his VP? Know about the VAWA?Any of his positions or messaging In the last thirty years? Did you read any of his books?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

sarabelle

(453 posts)
158. WAIT for it. Give the man a chance. Too many issues in one message is not helpful.
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 06:08 AM
Apr 2019

Let him take one at a time and thoroughly discuss his positions. Our main objective should be to get rid of Trump. We can get behind and promote an agenda once we have the power to enact and enforce it. Did we not learn anything from 2016?

All the noble and progressive and economically sound positions mean NOTHING unless we are in positions of power to enact and enforce them. First things first: Get Trump and as many GOP out of office as we can. The should be and MUST be our main objective now. Listen to Elizabeth Warren. Listen to the women, especially the African American women.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Mr Tibbs

(539 posts)
159. Trump needs to be challenged at every step
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 07:51 AM
Apr 2019

Bravo Joe

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Skya Rhen

(2,701 posts)
161. Joe is on the right track and woke-domestic terrorism is out of control. New leadership is needed...
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 03:32 PM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
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