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Celerity

(43,415 posts)
Wed Sep 29, 2021, 01:36 PM Sep 2021

If You Think Progressives Won't Compromise w/ Centrists, You Have It Backwards. Liberals are begging [View all]

to negotiate with centrists.

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2021/09/sinema-progressive-democrats-biden-build-back-better-infrastructure.html



The impression has taken hold with many people who have moderate inclinations that the Democratic Party is split between moderate pragmatists and left-wing ideologues who refuse to compromise. “There are growing signs the Biden agenda could collapse because too many Democrats have unrealistic expectations and refuse to compromise,” opined one of those research firms that recirculates conventional wisdom for investors. Charlie Sykes, editor of the center-right Bulwark, claims progressive Democrats are “threatening to torpedo the bipartisan bill (and with it the Biden presidency) if they don’t get what they want.” The truth of the situation at hand is almost precisely the opposite. The people who are willing to compromise and accept half a loaf are the progressives. The ones who refuse to negotiate are the centrists. Just listen to what the progressives are saying:

“What we have said is that if there is an agreement that the president strikes on this Build Back Better agenda, we will vote for the bipartisan bill, we’re willing to negotiate,” Representative Ro Khanna said on CNN. “The president keeps begging [Senator Kyrsten Sinema], ‘Tell us what you want. Put a proposal forward’ … How do you compromise when Sinema isn’t saying anything?” Congressional Progressive Caucus Chair Pramila Jayapal: “They need to tell us what they don’t agree with. And we need to be able to actually negotiate it.” Jayapal, again: “If they don’t tell us what they want to do, which was the president’s message, and if they don’t actually negotiate on the entire bill, then we’re not going to get too close.” Representative Jim McGovern: “I think a lot of us want to make sure we have an assurance that, in fact, there’s going to be a reconciliation bill.”

They are not making implacable demands. They are begging the centrists to simply negotiate. The fear hanging over their position is that, once they have their bipartisan infrastructure deal in hand, some decisive number of centrist Democrats — it would take just one in the Senate or four in the House — will take their ball and go home. Nobody knows whether that would actually happen. But the progressives are hardly imagining this possibility. Over the weekend, the New York Times reported that Sinema “has privately told colleagues she will not accept any corporate or income tax rate increases.” No other publication has matched this explosive finding, which might turn out to exaggerate her stance. On the other hand, she has not publicly denied it. Sinema also reportedly opposes both Biden’s plan to allow Medicare to negotiate prices with drug companies, and even opposes a scaled-back version designed to be less unacceptable to Big Pharma. The entire Biden program is financed through a combination of taxing the wealthy through higher income or corporate taxes and cutting spending by negotiating lower drug prices.

So if Sinema actually holds the positions indicated by these reports, she would kill Biden’s program outright. Biden’s domestic legacy is only going to be as large as its financing sources, and if Sinema opposes all those sources, the size of the bill she ultimately supports isn’t going to be $3.5 trillion or $2 trillion or $1.5 trillion, but zero. Business lobbyists are very clearly hoping to pass to pass the bipartisan infrastructure bill — which, at the insistence of Republicans, does not make any wealthy sources pay even a cent — and then kill Build Back Better. “Business groups and some Senate Republicans,” reports the Times, have “mounted an all-out drive to secure G.O.P. votes for a bipartisan infrastructure bill.” Since Sinema is holding fundraisers with the same lobbyists who are pushing to pass infrastructure and kill Build Back Better, it seems at least possible that she is onboard with their strategy. Perhaps she just wants to scale back Biden’s plan and has some specific objections she can share in private. The problem is that she’s acting like somebody who wants to kill Biden’s program outright. Progressives can’t be blamed for suspecting a betrayal, especially when she refuses to give even the barest reassurance.

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You are right. The media loves to pronounce Joe Biden's career dead Walleye Sep 2021 #1
To hear people tell their bullshit, Progressives are the problem. Autumn Sep 2021 #2
Yes. And bullshit for the other market is that "moderates" (grabbag slander Hortensis Sep 2021 #10
I agree, conservative moderates are the problem. There are no moderate Republicans. Not a one. Autumn Sep 2021 #49
:) That first's not quite what I meant. All Democrats are slandered as Hortensis Sep 2021 #53
Progressives are slandered by both Republicans and moderates. Sinema took a shot at them today. Autumn Sep 2021 #54
Is it even correct to call Manchin and Sinema "centrists". TheRealNorth Sep 2021 #3
Ooooh you are really stirring the pot. People ain't gonna be happy. LT Barclay Sep 2021 #4
What are they gonna do? Cheerlead for Pharma Joe Manchin and Krysssstiieennnn? BradAllison Sep 2021 #23
Oy. Staaahp! This designation of Manchin and Sinema as Scrivener7 Sep 2021 #5
as if calling them (which you just did) 'our version of the lunatic fringe' is not divisive? Celerity Sep 2021 #8
Well, then. I guess that different usage of "centrist" makes it OK to be divisive of Democrats. Scrivener7 Sep 2021 #52
you actually are trying to sell an angle that calling a centrist/moderate or moderate conservative Celerity Sep 2021 #55
I don't think those two are centrist. BlueLucy Sep 2021 #6
A bit disingenuous FBaggins Sep 2021 #7
Lol qazplm135 Sep 2021 #9
They're currently begging him to give them a number. FBaggins Sep 2021 #12
Everyone qazplm135 Sep 2021 #17
Continually? FBaggins Sep 2021 #24
a simple google search qazplm135 Sep 2021 #31
A simple google search that you won't include? FBaggins Sep 2021 #35
strange that qazplm135 Sep 2021 #37
Three And A Half, Sir, Is Already A Compromise Figure The Magistrate Sep 2021 #19
It wasn't a compromise with the moderates FBaggins Sep 2021 #22
lulzd Voltaire2 Sep 2021 #28
thank you qazplm135 Sep 2021 #32
Care to take a shot at proving your position? FBaggins Sep 2021 #38
Nonesense, Sir The Magistrate Sep 2021 #33
You appear to be dodging the part that would prove your position FBaggins Sep 2021 #36
The 'Debt Ceiling' Sir The Magistrate Sep 2021 #43
No doubt. And that might dodge the political issue if they can get away with it. FBaggins Sep 2021 #50
Lol. $1T and $1.5T weren't numbers that represented "negotiating" in the KPN Sep 2021 #27
How much are the Republicans offering? FBaggins Sep 2021 #29
Neither Sinema or Manchin will even list most of the exact programmes they want to cut Celerity Sep 2021 #13
Sorry for the lack of clarity. It's the progressives that are anxious now. FBaggins Sep 2021 #15
I realised that and changed my post before you replied. Celerity Sep 2021 #18
depends on which is more important to them qazplm135 Sep 2021 #40
It turns out that none of that was true FBaggins Sep 2021 #60
JFC, I wish people would stop calling those two Senators "centrist" or "moderate" themaguffin Sep 2021 #11
I was simply using the title of the article, which are labels (centrist, along with moderate and Celerity Sep 2021 #20
I know. My comment is in reference to the media. themaguffin Sep 2021 #34
Exactly. Two Senators. And they are using the same extremist Nixie Sep 2021 #26
They are certainly centrists compared to the trumpanzee goops wellst0nev0ter Sep 2021 #48
agreed Celerity Sep 2021 #56
We knew this week was going to be stressful Johnny2X2X Sep 2021 #14
Exactly, Ma'am The Magistrate Sep 2021 #16
Good points Sir. Celerity Sep 2021 #21
K&R bluewater Sep 2021 #25
"Progressive" and "liberal" are not synonyms. Spider Jerusalem Sep 2021 #30
they seem to often be used interchangeably in the US (and often only the US, as in the vast majority Celerity Sep 2021 #57
Only by people who are ignorant of nuance Spider Jerusalem Sep 2021 #58
whist I agree with you on this (as I already intimated) wholeheartedly Celerity Sep 2021 #59
If Manchin wants to wait until next year I feel like one of the things he is doing Tadpole Raisin Sep 2021 #39
not just that qazplm135 Sep 2021 #42
Exactly! +1000 bluewater Sep 2021 #46
The image is that Progressives are "extreme" soldierant Sep 2021 #41
Hear Hear, Ma'am The Magistrate Sep 2021 #44
+1 Celerity Sep 2021 #45
I Can't Even Say What I Think DanieRains Sep 2021 #47
Indeed! Evolve Dammit Sep 2021 #51
K&Fuckin'R Carlitos Brigante Sep 2021 #61
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