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Showing Original Post only (View all)Why the "My bad sex wasn't rape" editorial is so utterly, utterly vile. [View all]
So, this was posted: http://www.salon.com/2013/03/22/my_bad_sex_wasnt_rape/
I'm going to try to break down why this was so disgustingly, sickeningly wrong.
I say "try", because to do so properly would take a lot more time, because there is a shit ton of crap to sift through here.
First of all, let's take the verbiage she uses. Stuff like this:
sleeping with any girl who would spread her legs
Does that sound neutral to you? Sure doesn't sound that way to me. I've heard that terminology used many times, and never by anyone who respected women.
Let's move on.
Two weeks after we had sex for the first time, he and I and his best friend got drunk me for the first time in my life and I ended up having sex in a park with both of them. It was somewhat miserable...
This short passage gives us a lot to analyze. She lost her virginity at 15, and two weeks later is in a threesome. While drunk for the first time. But hey, it was only somewhat miserable, so she's lucky, I guess.
So yeah, that's not worthy of analysis at all, I'm sure. Surely not, in a culture in which young women are conditioned from birth to see their worth and value in their looks and sexual desirability. Messages which this particular woman started learning way too early, earlier than other girls who aren't introduced to that world... way too early. No, let's just pretend that she's perfectly reasonable to dismiss her desire to have sex when she didn't really want to in order to please males with a handwave. Cause really, how is that meaningful, right?
And let's just skip over fact that so many people here have been focusing like a laser on the idea that since it's not illegal everywhere for 15 year olds to have sex with 19 year olds, none of this is questionable at all. Let's assume that she was in one of those places where it was legal, and let's pretend that it is also meaningless that she was drunk for the first time, or that she had lost her virginity 14 days earlier and was now involved in her first threesome.
And let's also skip the part where she was sexually abused from 4 to 9. And let's also skip the part about her acting out with an old man in her neighborhood at age 12, engaging him in phone sex. For all we know, she considers this acting out part of her "agency" and exploring her own sexuality, so let's just leave that aside.
Let's just skip to the part about her not thinking it was rape. You know what? Good for her. I'm really happy for her that she doesn't feel victimized, and wasn't traumatized. That's nice for her.
But she isn't the only woman in the world, and for her to be pushing the idea that drunk 15 year olds are fair game is, frankly, beyond fucked up. We all know that teens will have sex when they want to. But the fact is that rapists use alcohol to rape. Her muddying the waters on this issue by pretending her experience is somehow noteworthy is bullshit.
So she didn't feel like she was raped, big fucking deal! A whole hell of a lot of women who first had sex at 15 don't feel like they were raped. A whole hell lot of a women who first had sex at 12 don't feel like they were raped either. No one is out there telling women that they have to feel that they were raped if they don't feel that way. Because if they don't, that's their prerogative.
No, what's important is reaching the tens of thousands of women each year who do feel that they were raped. What is important is reaching the women who do feel that they were raped but who still aren't reporting it. And what this person is doing is not fucking helping.
No, what she is doing is playing into the hands of MRAs and victim blamers who want to silence women. More on that later.
whether the coverage on CNN after the conviction was too sympathetic to the rapists (perhaps CNN went too far,...
"Whether" it was too sympathetic? Really? "Whether"?
"Perhaps" they went too far?
Telling, yes? Yes. Let's move on.
So much of victim blaming relies on these outmoded views of womens sexuality.
No, no it doesn't. Victim-blaming relies on bullshit ideas. For example, the one where some people like to trumpet the idea that women claim they were raped just because they didn't enjoy the sex, or they regretted it later. (Sound familiar? It should. Because Anna trumpeted that shit herself, in this piece of shit editorial. Good work, Anna!)
At the same time, it is not helpful to label every murky sexual encounter as rape or to say that anything any woman states is rape is, in fact, rape.
Yeah, that's a huge problem, taking women at their word. She's so brave to stick her neck out on this. Rapists and MRAs everywhere are so grateful a woman has finally had the courage to come out in a (supposedly) progressive publication and say that since women VERY RARELY lie about being raped, that makes it "not helpful" to label rape as rape, just because a woman says she was raped.
So great to see this being praised here on DU, really.
If they dont take control of their own erotic development early, they may never take control like the women I knew in college who blamed alcohol or drugs for their own sexual adventures or misadventures,
Yet another attempt to give credence to the victim-blaming lies that rape culture finds so comforting. I imagine, given what she said about the coverage of the Steubenville rapists, that the writer probably has all kinds of empathy for rapists in college.
Seeing a pattern here?
For most of us, we dont come into our own about articulating our specific wants and desires until late in life, if ever. Let us encourage a culture where everyone regardless of gender, orientation, etc. does so openly, honestly, respectfully. Let us all learn to say, I dont know how Im going to like that, but lets try it out. (We could take some lessons from the BDSM communities where boundaries and limits are strictly negotiated in advance.)
Yes, the BDSM community, where rape is even more common than in the so-called "vanilla" community. What stinking, stupid bullshit.
I guess that's gonna have to be enough. I'm not willing to spend the time that would be necessary to really expose every ounce of steaming shit in this thing.
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Why the "My bad sex wasn't rape" editorial is so utterly, utterly vile. [View all]
redqueen
Mar 2013
OP
what bothers me most about that article is the implication of the title
La Lioness Priyanka
Mar 2013
#1
She is being a good little girl just like her father taught her to be. You know, always protect the
LiberalLoner
Mar 2013
#17
ugh. sorry to hear that. i do agree with you that it's a good girl syndrome
La Lioness Priyanka
Mar 2013
#21
Lol well he is a homeless alcoholic at this point so, fail in general too....
LiberalLoner
Mar 2013
#133
She's only been published widely 3x: writing about her "boobs" , Dad as a lover
bettyellen
Mar 2013
#109
we watch a lot of people validate the rape culture and sexism for their own personal reasons. nt
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#213
Not to mention she describes her experiences with her father raping her as a 4 year old as
LiberalLoner
Mar 2013
#2
Thank you so much. Oh I hope it helps. Been feeling like we are losing the fight lately. Think
LiberalLoner
Mar 2013
#298
thank you jury 6. this is jsut another way for men to work at derailing these conversations.
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#29
What the hell is your problem? Normally I'm not one to jump on people but WTF?
nomorenomore08
Mar 2013
#193
Apparently the OP was, earlier in life. And is now trying to deal with that.
nomorenomore08
Mar 2013
#199
You do know this 'won't someone shut those wimminz up!' shit has been addressed in ATA.
redqueen
Mar 2013
#225
i think durham said it exactly right. reading you absurdity on how du should run, by such a newbie
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#289
no. they are picking apart her offensively hurtful and problematic article justifying, excusing rape
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#290
no. you did personally insult. and you try to take it further. but, lack ownership.
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#376
you cannot actually argue what is being said on here so your defense of the author fails
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#412
...what happened in Steubenville, with Natalia on “Girls,” and with me... all rape is ridiculous.
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#9
yes. and the hyperbole from duers accusing others of outrage with all the trash
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#31
yes. i get it. SOME men get off on the pain that it causes. it is after all how they define their
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#49
thats not bullshit, but Im wondering how You know what every porn watcher thinks.
Whisp
Mar 2013
#351
trying to conflate adult porn with underage shit is like trying to conflate adult sex w/child abuse
Warren DeMontague
Mar 2013
#352
I didn't assume you agreed with it... but I do disagree with you about women's (or girls')
redqueen
Mar 2013
#13
Perhaps the author was writing about herself, rather than to your specifications
cthulu2016
Mar 2013
#11
Yep. These kinds of attacks do damage to those of us that care about rape as an issue.
Generation_Why
Mar 2013
#35
another derail. tell women how if they speak out, you, a man, will no longer be able to support her
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#52
this is just another of the insults on du. being told that we are to continually address and educate
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#32
Which is just another example of why rape culture and the patriarchy are so successful...
redqueen
Mar 2013
#92
Some people choose to express themselves in a way that's not suitable to other's agendas...
Generation_Why
Mar 2013
#18
the point you and others miss. she is directing it to society, to women, to girls and to rapists...
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#23
about the same amount of courage that clarence thomas has on issues
La Lioness Priyanka
Mar 2013
#45
Just curious. In the 60s and 70s, "free love" was the ideal. How many people here
McCamy Taylor
Mar 2013
#30
Agreeing to sex that wasn't all that fun is not rape. Wanna know what rape is?
LiberalLoner
Mar 2013
#41
not to mention 60s ad 70s did not even have a word for date rape. was just the way it was.
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#97
I don't see it that quite that way. Nothing is free, and that 'free love' had a price to pay
Whisp
Mar 2013
#168
it really is not even about her. it is about those on du that refuse to think maybe there may be an
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#56
If some guy had written this stuff, I would be disgusted, would utterly condemn him,
Nye Bevan
Mar 2013
#106
Isn't that what everyone in this thread is doing? And if they aren't doing that, then why is it
patrice
Mar 2013
#283
k and r--thank you, redqueen I did not have the strength to get through that mess.
niyad
Mar 2013
#43
Thanks redqueen. I finished the other thread, got called away before I could respond
riderinthestorm
Mar 2013
#47
It is far, far worse. Because in rape culture, their voices are amplified exponentially.
redqueen
Mar 2013
#74
Yes, it's easy to see that she might have been just writing shit to get clicks.
redqueen
Mar 2013
#82
K&R Thank you for taking the time to do this very unpleasant task. n/t
Egalitarian Thug
Mar 2013
#78
sexual awesomeness and wallet. see, not hard. and rather useless. not to mention the damage it
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#139
reading comprehension is your friend. to go to all that bother and frame your issue so poorly
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#142
its not her personal story when she extrapolates from herself to others
La Lioness Priyanka
Mar 2013
#145
more insults? not an ability to actually address what you disagree with. just lazy insults?
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#291
lol. now i am a stalker. you good. i do not think there is a post, without personal attack. nt
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#379
Wow. Really? That guy didn't even understand the OP, and said "shame on you"...
redqueen
Mar 2013
#333
Agreed. And who are the fuckers at Salon that thought it was a good idea to post this on their site
Evoman
Mar 2013
#151
i believe there is research that states it is a real issue, a community outcry there is an issue.
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#181
that would have been the point in the article and how important it was to police the community and
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#187
If you are going to say "even more often", you should have proper citations to prove it
riqster
Mar 2013
#252
Sexual counseling from someone whose lost her virginity at age 4 via her own father
rocktivity
Mar 2013
#176
Yeah, it's the idea that what the other person (usually female) wants doesn't matter.
nomorenomore08
Mar 2013
#202
"No one is out there telling women that they have to feel that they were raped" is a horrible line.
Igel
Mar 2013
#241
Thank you. That stuff doesn't hurt me anymore. Hearing people support rape or
LiberalLoner
Mar 2013
#404
well, redq. i saw a thread that cheered the article. and i see a thread that challenges it.
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#318
Or they tell us to take the discussion to some man-free zone and be good little
LiberalLoner
Mar 2013
#322
ah, i was told just this morning, again, it is my "tone". lol. 'pose to be nicer. nt
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#325
Yeah... what I don't get is how posts calling out rapists, or rape culture, or sexual harassment
redqueen
Mar 2013
#340
Maybe there is a reason for that...was just watching a crime show and heard
LiberalLoner
Mar 2013
#343
That's what I'm trying to figure out. That's why I wondered if they might
LiberalLoner
Mar 2013
#411
I'm not sure her father raping her at four could be called "a sexually bad experience."
LiberalLoner
Mar 2013
#278
Was that in the article? I don't suppose it matters that it wasn't if it's true, so I'll edit the
patrice
Mar 2013
#281
Oh, no, it was another article she wrote, one of three she has had published.
LiberalLoner
Mar 2013
#282
Thank you for the information. No doubt about it, childhood experiences, especially of
patrice
Mar 2013
#284
Thank you. I've been there and find it triggering. I'm also a bit suspicious
LiberalLoner
Mar 2013
#321
at a time when so many are questioning whether raping a gilr that is unconscious is really rape, you
seabeyond
Mar 2013
#293
Would you ever dare to say that people who claim to be mugged ought not to be taken at their word
redqueen
Mar 2013
#337
It's so hurtful. I can't fathom the jollies that some of these folks get out
myrna minx
Mar 2013
#398
I had the same revulsion for what I call the good girl role, making sure not to
LiberalLoner
Mar 2013
#381