Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

kenny blankenship

(15,689 posts)
19. This is the danger of AUMF style resolutions as opposed to straight up War! declarations
Sat Sep 14, 2013, 06:32 PM
Sep 2013

The AUMF on Iraq was a blank check for war that pretended that it was not a blank check for war. It purported to set "tough" conditions on the use of force and prohibit it if those conditions weren't met by the Executive. The Executive never even bothered with fulfilling the theatrical requirements supposedly placed on it, but barged ahead into Iraq, knowing there would be no consequences. Such a resolution allows people like Kerry to say that they voted FOR something, and also AGAINST something in voting yes on the bill. They must admit they voted yes to the bill, but they say they were always against what it authorized. They can argue they were on either side later on, for or against, at different times, according to whichever seems more politically advantageous at the moment. That's what Kerry is doing. How can they do this? Because a bill like the AUMF pretends to be a neutral flowchart of decision making, a set of contingencies which trigger set consequences. He voted Yes but says he was against the war. That is a lie. It's a lie because everyone who isn't a fucking liar or in an institution for mental incompetents knew that there was no way the Executive branch would supply answers to those contingencies in any way but in manner that led to war. Kerry bid the Iraq war commence, adopting a craven and dishonest posture of saying "but only if thus and such are the case". It's no surprise he makes use of the duplicity built into the Iraq War AUMF because bills are crafted to allow crafty folks to lie out of both sides of their mouths like this. "I voted Yes, but I was against the main thing that the bill authorized!" Bullshit you were, John. Bullshit you are now.

A danger we face, now that straight up WARRRR!!!! has been rejected by Congress, is that the Administration and the leadership of both parties, unified in wanting war, will craft another such contingency laden war resolution, supposedly placing strong conditions on the authorization of force, but in practice letting 'er rip just like Congress did when Bush was President. The War Preznit will say he needs this pre-authorization to look credible in negotiations, and the Congress can escape the immediate hit they would have taken in public opinion for voting yes to straight up WAARRRR!!!! The consequences for voting Yes will be deferred. Responsibility can all be shunted onto UN weapons inspectors, or onto the President, who's not up for reelection anyway. It becomes much easier to vote to make war when it is worded as a contingency: if report comes back X, then we do Y. That way we weren't slavering for war, we were just blandly following a bureaucratic procedure (to join in the butchery.) And politicians can say in the future, like Kerry says of his shameful past, that they weren't voting for war. Oh no! They opposed the idea of war. They just voted Yes on a neutral resolution that said that military action might be taken when some conditions were met. It didn't say war would definitely be launched! It's not their fault of course, that the President didn't bother to fulfill his obligations, or if the UN inspectors couldn't satisfy the President... Except their names are still recorded in the Yea column on the bill that authorized the war.

Kerry also made the same claim about Chuck Hagel, who voted for invasion Bluenorthwest Sep 2013 #1
It's gargle-wargle CYA by Kerry. Tierra_y_Libertad Sep 2013 #2
Kerry did oppose the decision, ProSense Sep 2013 #3
There you go... Dr Hobbitstein Sep 2013 #4
You have an elastic definition of fact. rug Sep 2013 #6
Not so much... Dr Hobbitstein Sep 2013 #15
he was looking at the facts but voted anyway. anyone who allowed this atrocity roguevalley Sep 2013 #30
The facts came out AFTER... Dr Hobbitstein Sep 2013 #31
It's convenient to ignore that Bush lied in order to attack Kerry. ProSense Sep 2013 #35
^This... Dr Hobbitstein Sep 2013 #36
Why isn't Kerry center stage of a Bush prosecution process? n/t PowerToThePeople Sep 2013 #40
no he isn't evil incarnate. how is it when someone questions a roguevalley Sep 2013 #49
You knew it was bullshit, I knew it was bullshit, plenty of Americans LuvNewcastle Sep 2013 #38
"The IWR was not a vote to attack Iraq"? rug Sep 2013 #5
It wasn't a declaration of war, ProSense Sep 2013 #7
It was a joint resolution to authorize the use of United States Armed Forces against Iraq. rug Sep 2013 #8
incredible, isn't it. KG Sep 2013 #10
Sadly, no. rug Sep 2013 #13
What do you call it if it isn't Aerows Sep 2013 #11
Well, ProSense Sep 2013 #27
Be careful, everyone. Watch your footing Vanje Sep 2013 #29
So, if Bush lied? PowerToThePeople Sep 2013 #34
The U.S. Congress has not formally declared war since 1942. former9thward Sep 2013 #57
If an authorization to use military force Aerows Sep 2013 #9
revisionism? KG Sep 2013 #12
That's the ONLY thing I could call it Aerows Sep 2013 #14
Quick question Aerows Sep 2013 #16
AUMF... YvonneCa Sep 2013 #21
No, that was for Afghanistan, passed September 14, 2011. rug Sep 2013 #23
I am trying to figure out how this is relevant to anything The Straight Story Sep 2013 #17
The relevance, as pointed out in the OP, is that AnotherMcIntosh Sep 2013 #18
Ok...and that means what exactly? The Straight Story Sep 2013 #20
This is the danger of AUMF style resolutions as opposed to straight up War! declarations kenny blankenship Sep 2013 #19
John Kerry wants to have it both ways. bvar22 Sep 2013 #22
Senators Boxer and Durbin voted against the IWR, but voted for the Syria resolution: ProSense Sep 2013 #25
We stand passively mute. Thank you Senator Byrd. Autumn Sep 2013 #26
But Senator Byrd was a racist who voted against the Civil Rights Act... Dr Hobbitstein Sep 2013 #32
If you chose to think I stand with a racist Senator Byrd, please do so. Autumn Sep 2013 #37
So a racist who voted against the Civil Rights Act can change... Dr Hobbitstein Sep 2013 #39
I don't believe Senator Byrd ever denied voting against the Civil Rights Act. Autumn Sep 2013 #42
Kerry never denied voting for the IWR... Dr Hobbitstein Sep 2013 #43
He voted for the IWR, Iraq War Resolution. Autumn Sep 2013 #45
And Robert Byrd doesn't like black people... Dr Hobbitstein Sep 2013 #47
Do as you will. Autumn Sep 2013 #48
Excellent rebuttal, bvar2 Carolina Sep 2013 #28
Those who voted No should be lauded. And special note that the single Republican who Bluenorthwest Sep 2013 #53
He may as well have said that he still can have erections.... MrMickeysMom Sep 2013 #24
Yo OP where you go? snooper2 Sep 2013 #33
Sure! Factcheck.org says Kerry is revising history Stupefacto Sep 2013 #44
Congrats on 18 posts! snooper2 Sep 2013 #58
Why are you trying to trash the SOS at this point? treestar Sep 2013 #41
A politician that takes on a new function is free to rewrite his voting history? Celefin Sep 2013 #51
It's worse, he was not asked, he offered up this misinformation in service to himself Bluenorthwest Sep 2013 #54
Kerry obviously can do it treestar Sep 2013 #56
Hmmm ...where have I heard this kind of shit before ...Oh yeah ...I was for it before I was... L0oniX Sep 2013 #46
Intellectually bankrupt. All he had to do was vote against as his betters did cali Sep 2013 #50
You mean ProSense Sep 2013 #55
If Kerry relies on his position on the Iraq war LiberalAndProud Sep 2013 #52
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»John Kerry says he ‘oppos...»Reply #19