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jeff47

(26,549 posts)
2. Nah, there is something worse
Mon Apr 21, 2014, 12:27 PM
Apr 2014

That's all the Democrats who attack other Democrats for doing something they did not do.

Such as this lie:

the spying apologists who believe Americans cannot be trusted to use the internet and live our lives without an NSA chaperone.

I realize this is a very appealing lie. You can rage against it instead of dealing with the pesky reality of SCOTUS decisions, and the details of what was actually leaked.

But that doesn't make it true. And bashing people for a lie you like does not help. Either with fixing the problem, or electing more Democrats so we can fix the problem. Because you can not fix a problem when you lie about it.

Snowden, Manning, et al have so far leaked one program that spied on US persons. One. The phone metadata program. Every other leaked program targeted a non-US person. Non-US Persons do not have any constitutional rights. Even when they are Chancellor of Germany. If the NSA was really doing massive spying on US persons, how come they didn't leak a second program? Possibly even a third?

The phone metadata program fits nicely under an overly-broad 1979 SCOTUS ruling that made your phone metadata no more private than what you ordered the last time you went to a resturaunt. Or bought at the grocery store. Or any other routine business record.

To fix it, we need a new law from Congress. Sure, the President could tell the NSA to stop, but that won't stop future presidents. More importantly, it won't stop private spying - your phone metadata is available to anyone willing to buy it.

Appealing lies will not get us that fix.
While I agree with you that the NSA and the other progeny of the Patriot Act Swede Atlanta Apr 2014 #1
What a weird thing to say.... clarice Apr 2014 #22
I think you're on the money there. randome Apr 2014 #25
Nah, there is something worse jeff47 Apr 2014 #2
how many attacks have been prevented by monitoring Chancellor Merkel's private phone conversations? frylock Apr 2014 #3
Don't know. But that doesn't make it unconstitutional. jeff47 Apr 2014 #5
i never claimed it to be unconstitutional.. frylock Apr 2014 #8
So the goal was to change the subject. jeff47 Apr 2014 #14
funny, you're the one who brought the chancellor frylock Apr 2014 #15
And you're the one who measured against terrorist attacks. jeff47 Apr 2014 #16
okay, so NSA surveillance ISN'T about preventing terrorist activity.. frylock Apr 2014 #17
No, SOME NSA surveillance is. SOME NSA surveillance is not. jeff47 Apr 2014 #18
so what was to be gained by monitoring Chancellor Merkel's personal phone calls? frylock Apr 2014 #19
We find out what Germany is going to be doing jeff47 Apr 2014 #20
This shows something RobertEarl Apr 2014 #24
Hi Robert! We all dead yet? jeff47 Apr 2014 #26
Whoa, dude RobertEarl Apr 2014 #29
You should back off a little. zappaman Apr 2014 #36
I think they would be foolish if they could, and they didn't. nt. NCTraveler Apr 2014 #33
Who cares? MohRokTah Apr 2014 #6
i care. you don't.. frylock Apr 2014 #9
I'm pretty damned sure the NSA protects the president's communications. MohRokTah Apr 2014 #11
and being that you're pretty damned sure, you'd be pretty damned pissed.. frylock Apr 2014 #12
If another nation were to break that security,... MohRokTah Apr 2014 #13
I'd be amused. joshcryer Apr 2014 #30
There are no laws or treaties against foreign spying. joshcryer Apr 2014 #28
Ever read the privacy agreement you got from your telephone company? sabrina 1 Apr 2014 #27
But..but...they're doing it to protect freedom and democracy....oh, wait. Tierra_y_Libertad Apr 2014 #4
I doubt any have ever participated with Greenpeace, Veterans For Peace, OWS, the Quakers etc. G_j Apr 2014 #7
The defenders of Clapper and the NSA here are nauseating. bvar22 Apr 2014 #10
... SidDithers Apr 2014 #21
There is nothing worse for the Democratic Party than needless hyperbole. randome Apr 2014 #23
100% false, just like a global warming denier claiming Earth is actually cooling, NSA spying pragmatic_dem Apr 2014 #34
Where is your proof? jazzimov Apr 2014 #35
It took .23 seconds for 24,000 results, warrantless spying on Americans, pragmatic_dem Apr 2014 #38
jazzimov asked for 'proof', not number of Google hits. randome Apr 2014 #40
In May of 2002, DU was pretty unified in its opposition to the NSA's revelation that all incoming an LanternWaste Apr 2014 #31
While I do think there are worse things for the party... NCTraveler Apr 2014 #32
Really? Democractic Party leadership endorsement for spending 100s of billions on citizen pragmatic_dem Apr 2014 #37
Please read my post again. Seems you didn't before you replied. NCTraveler Apr 2014 #39
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