Gun Control & RKBA
In reply to the discussion: This message was self-deleted by its author [View all]jimmy the one
(2,708 posts)sari/jeff: "The Constitution of most of our states (and of the United States) assert that all power is inherent in the people; that they may exercise it by themselves; that it is their right and duty to be at all times armed."
Who added in parentheses 'and of the United States'? because that addendum evidently does not appear in Thomas Jefferson's original writing to John Cartwright in 1824, 31 years after 2ndA was written. Did you add that sari? trying to be sneaky? or was it some other pro gun enthusiast taking things out of context or making things up?
http://www.thefederalistpapers.org/founders/jefferson/thomas-jefferson-letter-to-john-cartwright-1824
http://www.marksquotes.com/Founding-Fathers/Jefferson/index9.htm
In context, jeff was contending 'most of our states' claim it is their right & duty to be at all times armed - and he could be referring to militia duty. By 1824 some states had morphed into an individual rkba, but most I think still retained the militia interpretation. Jeff evidently was not referring to the 2nd amendment in his letter to cartwright.
2) On Madison, sari cites: Americans have the right and advantage of being armed, unlike the people of other countries, whose leaders are afraid to trust them with arms."
Did James Madison write 'Americans have the right and advantage of being armedunlike the citizens of other countries whose governments are afraid to trust the people with arms' in the Federalist Papers #46?
No. Two phrases are his, but the words linking them are not.
In 1787 .. Madison argued that the existence of state militias should prevent that possibility ... One question involved the proposed federal armymight it not become an instrument of tyranny? Madison argued that the existence of state militias should prevent that possibility. In that context he wrote
Madison in context: It may well be doubted, whether a militia thus circumstanced could ever be conquered by such a proportion of regular troops. Those who are best acquainted with the last successful resistance of this country against the British arms, will be most inclined to deny the possibility of it. Besides the advantage of being armed, which the Americans possess over the people of almost every other nation, the existence of subordinate governments, to which the people are attached, and by which the militia officers are appointed, forms a barrier against the enterprises of ambition, more insurmountable than any which a simple government of any form can admit of. Notwithstanding the military establishments in the several kingdoms of Europe, which are carried as far as the public resources will bear, the governments are afraid to trust the people with arms.
http://fakehistory.wordpress.com/2011/01/25/madison-and-the-advantage-of-being-armed/
fakehistory adds: The fake quotation as given is not an unreasonable summary of one of Madisons points, and had it been phrased
Americans have the right and advantage of being armedunlike the citizens of other countries whose governments are afraid to trust the people with arms it would probably be acceptable.
Note how Madison was referring to 'militia' when he prefaced his paragraph.
But it all adds up to gun enthusiasts trying to portray America's 2ndA as a singular individual rkba proven by Madison as he contrasted it with other countries, but Madison obviously didn't think the 2ndA was singular, just compared it to other nations whose govts disallowed firearms, which did exist but was not European overall policy.