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benEzra

(12,148 posts)
14. You are confusing cavitation with fragmentation.
Tue Jul 7, 2015, 04:47 PM
Jul 2015

Last edited Tue Jul 7, 2015, 05:51 PM - Edit history (1)

".. in context I wrote this: .. the .223 was designed for against humans, to incapacitate with grotesque exit wounds & internal fragmentation, rather than a desired quick kill. If cavitation occurs the animal can wander off & be in unbearable pain for days, moreso than with other hunting bullets

If cavitation occurs it would of course add to the incapacitating damage done; other bullets are moreso designed to kill rather than incapacitate as the .223. "

All bullets cavitate; that's what produces the temporary cavity. Rifle bullets cavitate more than handgun bullets. Big rifle bullets like .30-06 cavitate more than small rifle bullets like .223 (and .30-06 can throw a 55gr bullet at over 4000 ft/sec, or a 110gr at 3400, if you want to talk high velocity).

What you appear to be thinking of is fragmentation, which can result in a shallow, nonfatal wound if an inappropriately fragile bullet is used to hunt a big-game animal. And what you don't seem to understand is that fragmentation is a function of bullet choice, not caliber choice. A 55 to 70 grain bonded core .223 bullet designed to stay together on impact will stay together on impact, and penetrate like a scaled-down .270, whereas a 40gr varmint bullet will turn to powder and small fragments upon impact, and penetrate like light birdshot.

Likewise, a 58gr VMAX out of a .243 Winchester at 3925 ft/sec will fragment more violently than any .223, whereas a 100gr Hornady SST out of the same rifle won't fragment at all. So you pick one for coyote hunting and another for deer hunting.

"other bullets are moreso designed to kill rather than incapacitate as the .223."

So .223 Remington should be banned because it's not as lethal as a full-power rifle? Wow. And again, some .223 loads fragment and some don't, just like 9mm, .243, .270, .308, .30-06, and every other centerfire caliber out there; it depends entirely on load choice, not caliber. But with any style bullet, .223 will produce a less severe wound than a more powerful rifle shooting the same class of bullet will, because .223 doesn't have the powder capacity to match the kinetic energy or achievable velocity of the larger calibers for a given bullet mass.
Great rebuttal Ben DonP Jul 2015 #1
Great post! Hangingon Jul 2015 #2
Wait a minute! I smell a rat! Nuclear Unicorn Jul 2015 #3
I would assume you can use both, depending on your target Travis_0004 Jul 2015 #4
The author of the OP you just fisked posted this a few months ago: friendly_iconoclast Jul 2015 #5
"In my case, you called me names, insulted my intelligence and integrity." pablo_marmol Jul 2015 #6
More guns than fingers? Ooooh. Sooo impressive. AtheistCrusader Jul 2015 #31
Another outstanding takedown, benEzra. pablo_marmol Jul 2015 #7
You are approximately five times more likely to win the lottery than be murdered by a .223 cal rifle the band leader Jul 2015 #8
It seems a response to this thread was posted Somewhere Else... benEzra Jul 2015 #9
picking nits & bigger game jimmy the one Jul 2015 #10
Facts inconvenient to your thesis = "nitpicking". benEzra Jul 2015 #11
+1. Once again, verifiable truth is shown to be superior to mere weight of verbiage friendly_iconoclast Jul 2015 #12
cavitation jimmy the one Jul 2015 #13
You are confusing cavitation with fragmentation. benEzra Jul 2015 #14
cavitation jimmy the one Jul 2015 #15
Thoughts... benEzra Jul 2015 #16
incredible super cavitation jimmy the one Jul 2015 #17
Given that we are talking about the least misused guns... benEzra Jul 2015 #18
the dancer undulates to the music jimmy the one Jul 2015 #19
Well, to get pedantic... benEzra Jul 2015 #21
pink floyd is wrong jimmy the one Jul 2015 #22
modification jimmy the one Jul 2015 #23
Then you should tell all the physicists working on supercavitating projectiles, blades, and foils benEzra Jul 2015 #24
What's the big deal? discntnt_irny_srcsm Jul 2015 #25
"A little learning is a dang'rous thing;... friendly_iconoclast Jul 2015 #27
This subthread gives me life. Brickbat Jul 2015 #28
enriched jimmy the one Jul 2015 #30
. Nuclear Unicorn Jul 2015 #20
This is all the more hilarious if you know the origins of this image. AtheistCrusader Jul 2015 #33
I'm afraid I don't. Now I'm aching with curiosity. Nuclear Unicorn Jul 2015 #34
Allow me AtheistCrusader Jul 2015 #35
Oh my. Nuclear Unicorn Jul 2015 #36
Possibly the most expressive cat I've ever seen AtheistCrusader Jul 2015 #37
Um, no. AtheistCrusader Jul 2015 #32
As I'm sure you know HassleCat Jul 2015 #26
The posters were arguing for bans, not background checks. benEzra Jul 2015 #29
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