Epstein Clinton link?

[groundloop]

Since the news of Jeffry Epstein's arrest came out, and his link to tRump, a few people have mentioned that Epstein was also friendly with Bill Clinton. I knew nothing of that, so wasn't able to offer up any kind of response.

All I've been able to find so far is that Bill Clinton rode on Epstein's plane a number of times. I'm sure that the right wingers I work with will be bringing up the Clinton connection, so can anyone point me toward some factual information about this?

[no_hypocrisy]

1. I'm expecting something but I don't know what.

Expect MAGAts to make reference to the Mile High Club with regard to those airplane trips.

Your online search is as good as mine.

Please share whatever you find.

[EffieBlack]

2. You can start here:

http://www.google.com

[groundloop]

12. Thanks, that was ever so helpful.

Do you think I'd be posting this if I hadn't spent some time with google first?

DUH.

[emulatorloo]

28. I guess if you couldn't find anything on google, maybe you should self-delete your OP?

[Tiggeroshii]

80. .

https://www.vox.com/2018/12/3/18116351/jeffrey-epstein-indictment-arrested-trump-clinton-acosta

[rzemanfl]

84. Duh? n/t

[George II]

99. If you couldn't find that "Epstein Clinton link" on google, perhaps it doesn't exist?

Maybe you can find something on Breitbart or Infowars. They love making stuff up.

[Tiggeroshii]

127. or vox?

https://www.vox.com/2018/12/3/18116351/jeffrey-epstein-indictment-arrested-trump-clinton-acosta

[gratuitous]

3. I've heard about that, too

The funny thing about having principles (principles like don't sex traffic girls) is that they apply to folks you don't like as well as folks you like. If Clinton is shown to have participated in the sex trafficking (rather than simply being friendly with a very wealthy man), I'll gladly see him go down for it. A person has to be a special kind of stupid to think that if Clinton was mixed up in Epstein's sleaziness it somehow lets Trump off the hook for the same thing. I realize that argument will be put forward by some Very Serious People, but it should be called for the bullshit it is each and every time.

[underpants]

8. Excellent post

As usual

✅

[Proud Liberal Dem]

11. I've heard this too and I agree with it

but why are people already convinced that he's guilty of *something* ?

[pangaia]

46. becausae :"clinton'

[sheshe2]

106. Bingo

[samnsara]

77. just preparing for the worse, hoping for the best...

[EffieBlack]

22. There has never been any evidence that Clinton was involved with Epstein's sleazy sex life

And you can bet that, if there was even a scintilla, it would have been rubbed in our faces years ago by the people who turned consensual sex, Benghazi and some stray emails into years-long scandals.

[Eliot Rosewater]

35. And yet I can almost guarantee you they will talk about it as much as the link with rump

Not everybody is who they say they are, by the way.

All around us ALL the time there are PRETEND democrats, PRETEND liberals who are working feverishly to divide us.

[mcar]

93. Oh yeah

The both siders will be all over this one.

[Eliot Rosewater]

112. America jumped the shark, or humped it, when it allowed putin to install the traitor

[mfcorey1]

182. And they will be lead by Joe Scarborough who is obsessed with Bill Clinton.

[lapucelle]

183. The only thing I heard from Joe today was that EVERYBODY knew about Epstein

and therefore had a duty to say/do something about it.

Everybody knew, Joe? Then why didn't YOU do or say something about it?

[DeminPennswoods]

82. That's what I think as well

Republicans, conservatives, rightwingers have spent decades digging up dirt on the Clinton's. If there was even a whisper of Clinton and underage girls, the Rs would have made it front page news in 2016 and kept it there. Look at Benghazi, Hillary's email, Vince Foster, Juanita Brodderick...I could go on.

But citing Bill Clinton is useful for a media culture of "whataboutism" or "the other side does it, too".

[Polybius]

186. Unless they can't bring it up for one important reason

Many of their top guys are linked too. Hell, Epstein even reportedly taped federal judges having sex with his workers to use it against them.

[lapucelle]

89. You're so right.

A Freedom of Information Act request for Secret Service records of visits Clinton may have made to Epstein’s Little St. James Island produced no such evidence.

https://www.politico.com/story/2017/05/04/jeffrey-epstein-trump-lawsuit-sex-trafficking-237983

[mcar]

94. Stop letting facts get in the way of a good Clinton bashing!

[ehrnst]

119. The long knives have come out, haven't they? (nt)

[mcar]

142. They always do

Some here seem more determined to trash Democrats than to fight Republicans.

[aikoaiko]

152. That is very encouraging. Thanks for posting it.

[LiberalFighter]

104. Kenneth Starr would had brought it out back then if it existed.

[Pachamama]

179. Agree....but....

....Unless of course Kenneth Starr is part of this whole ring and cover up....

Nothing, and I mean nothing shocks or surprises me anymore. And as we live in the age of the Russians having interfered in our election and of Kompromat, and in an era of excessive wealth and plutocrats globally and live by "different rules" than the rest of us (including for example wealthy parents of college students who pay $100,000's to get their kids in through the side door to college), and an America where children are separated from their parents and being imprisoned in unthinkable and inhumane conditions (and who many we probably don't even know where they may be and never will) - why would it be surprising to find out about the existence of a massive sex trafficking ring of underage girls being run by wealthy men , who are protected by all of each other and are everything from wealthy businessmen, Lawyers, Law Enforcement, even Judges - that includes members of both sides of the political spectrum, christians and jews alike, and even women (i.e.. Ghislaine Maxwell)?

Look at this whole story and all the very "coincidental" links and connections to one another..... Alan Dershowitz? Kenneth Starr? William Barr (his father even?). Alex Acosta. Trump. Mar A Lago. Robert Kraft and prostitution and sex trafficking. British fucking family member. MBS was friends with Epstein!!!! I am sure the list of people is very long that we don't know about. Just look at the little black book of Jeffrey Epstein and The Who's who of who is in it and many who were mortified their names appear in it.

All I know is that there is a lot of evil shit going on out there and I think many many people have been covering for each other and it should not shock us who is complicit and how and why.

Silence amongst secret societies and groups often is done because each member has the goods on each other and their is a code of silence to keep them silent.

One should not assume a member would use something if it existed. Because silence is the code to keep all members in check.

And I bet right now there are a lot of nervous members who are praying that code of silence holds.

[LiberalFighter]

189. That code needs to get smashed.

Good journalism will help make some of it happen.

[Pachamama]

190. +1000000

I completely agree

Julie Brown from the Miami Herald deserves a Pulitzer Prize

[Zoonart]

176. So true... the Rethugs have been digging

dirt on Bill and Hillary for forty years. If there had been a provable connection with Epstein's rape escapades... they would have used it by now. Especially since we know how close Trump and Epstein were.

[MLAA]

23. Exactly, rape is rape. Doesn't matter if R or D. If guilty, they need to be in prison.

[StarfishSaver]

37. They also have to be a special kind of stupid to think that if Clinton were connected to any of this

we wouldn't have heard about it by now, given how he's been investigated obsessively for decades.

[JI7]

39. +

[Baltimike]

42. +

[uponit7771]

69. true

[uponit7771]

68. Yep

[cwydro]

4. The Clintons were friendly with the orange abomination at one time.

Rich folk frequently run together.

[karynnj]

62. "friendly" in both cases is likely an exaggeration

Epstein was/is a very wealthy man, who leaned toward Democrats in his political contributions - as did a younger Donald Trump. Very wealthy donors get invited to parties and private events for candidates. This gives them the perception that they have access to the candidate and that they will be listened to - and, in fact, they do have some impact on positions. However, it does not really make them friends.

In Bill Clinton's case, he also raised money for his Foundation, that does good work - which it could not do without the money that he raises. The comments that Epstein provided a plane for a trip to Africa for Clinton and others from the Foundation is no different than this -- and the key is what Clinton did on that trip. He was there supporting and reviewing programs that his Foundation sponsored that did things like fight AIDS.

No one is one dimensional and people do compartmentalize their lives. Epstein clearly wanted to be seen as one of the power elite --and he got some level of that by giving money. I would bet that Epstein was smart enough to know that many of the influential people he gave money to to make himself connected to the rich and powerful, would work to get him charged and end trafficking if they saw anything of that nature. For someone skilled at estimating risk, it is very likely that what he gave for access was legal contributions to campaigns, PACs, and NGOs .. rather than offering something illegal and immoral, which if exposed would destroy their careers?

It is possible that others, who seemed to share the same lack of values were completely aware of everything.

[DeminPennswoods]

83. They were invited and attended one of the Trump

weddings. It's also been reported that Chelsea and Ivanka are/were friendly.

[ehrnst]

109. "Run together?"

Nice shiv there....

[cwydro]

126. That's just an expression. Wtf?

Lighten up Francis.

I’m a longtime Hillary fan and believe the Big Dog was one of our best presidents.

Man. The things people take offense to here. Jesus Christ. Smh.

[ehrnst]

132. Just letting you know how it sounded.

You're welcome.

[cwydro]

133. Well, I must be missing something...

What should I have said, “hang out together?”

Guess my mind doesn’t work in ways that makes an innocent expression sound like a “shiv.”

Your concern is duly noted.

[jberryhill]

5. Surprising fact - Extremely Wealthy People Often Associate With Politicians

That particular wet blanket works two ways.

But, yesterday I learned on DU, this Epstein indictment was going to lead to the simultaneous end of the Trump and Pence terms of office.

Today, I can read an indictment which does not even allude to the action of any public official.

Keeping people from making wild speculations on social media is like keeping a dog from licking up its own vomit time and time again.

[samnsara]

14. oooooo maybe thats why pence rushed back.....trump heard of this and pences name

..is attached. My brains spiraling downhill thinking what may come out of this. pence resigns and trump makes barr veep..AACCKKK I need a drink....

[jberryhill]

33. Mmmm-hmmm

Same people every time, too.

[cwydro]

105. Lol!

No kidding!

[leftstreet]

15. LOL

Keeping people from making wild speculations on social media is like keeping a dog from licking up its own vomit time and time again.

Okay that made me laugh

[watoos]

47. I will be shocked

if public officials are not implicated in this case seeing who is doing the investigation. I am not in the least insinuating that people like Trump or Clinton will be involved.

[jberryhill]

130. Yes, no doubt you'll be shocked....

....just as you must have been upon the dawning realization that Louise Mensch is full of shit, and that Michael Avenatti is a crooked self-promoting blowhard.

Life can be full of one shock after another if one buys into breathless sensational bullshit on social media.

[lapfog_1]

124. "even allude to the action of any public official"

but the criminal indictment was prepared by the office of public corruption in the SDNY AG office, not the sex crimes division.

Which leads people to speculate.

Is Trump the target... or someone else... or maybe Acosta who probably violated the law when he created the NPA without telling any of the victims.

[yardwork]

6. OMG OMG! Bill Clinton! Hair on fire! Squirrel!

[sheshe2]

123. Wait! What?

Next thing ya know we will be hearing about that the sex parlor that Hillary ran out of the basement of a pizza joint was funded by Epstein.

Anatomy of a Fake News Scandal

Inside the web of conspiracy theorists, Russian operatives, Trump campaigners and Twitter bots who manufactured the ‘news’ that Hillary Clinton ran a pizza-restaurant child-sex ring

https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/anatomy-of-a-fake-news-scandal-125877/

Pizzagate II.

[underpants]

7. Yes there are links. Expect to hear a lot of this on RW media

This was a big thing with them a few years ago. Epstein had a lot of contacts all over the spectrum. Dershowitz among them.

[Arkansas Granny]

9. I've heard about Clinton flying on Epstein's plane, but I never heard anything more than that.

[groundloop]

16. Yeah, that's all I've come up with too.

I just wish I could find more facts to help me refute the inevitable bullshit that's going to be thrown out there in defense of tRump.

[EffieBlack]

24. Impossible to prove a negative

The impossibility of proving something DIDN’T happen is what Clinton’s enemies bank on...

[JI7]

27. yup, while ignoring facts about those others they support

[groundloop]

31. Absolutely. And repubs are very gifted at exploiting that fact.

[emulatorloo]

36. If you can't find facts, then why would you want to spread these rumors?

I admit to being confused.

[lapucelle]

59. That's probably all you've "come up with" because that's probably all that happened.

[lunatica]

92. Tell them to prove their allegations.

[ehrnst]

118. Well, calling it bullshit and lies is pretty much what you do...

You don't throw up your hands in despair, you ask for their sources....

Then you shoot the sources down.

Why all the hand wringing???

[sheshe2]

149. I smell PizzaGate 2, the sequel coming.

[George II]

162. Can I get mine with pepperoni?

[sheshe2]

165. Bologna!

[lapfog_1]

57. Epstein also was connected to the Clinton Foundation

both as a donor and possibly as one of the co-founders.

So far there has not been an allegation of Bill Clinton having sexual conduct with underage girls from the few who has testified... but then we only have testimony from a very few of the dozens to hundreds of women involved.

Of the women who have come forward with allegations of people other than Epstein they were to engage with sexually include Prince Andrew, Alan Dershowitz, President Trump, and many other current or former world leaders (Bill Richardson). There is also an allegation that these sexual contacts were secretly recorded by Epstein to be used to blackmail the various powerful people involved.

[lapucelle]

65. "Epstein also was connected to the Clinton Foundation ... possibly as one of the co-founders"?

[lapfog_1]

71. ok...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clinton_Foundation

"Disgraced financier Jeffrey Epstein is also said, according to his lawyers, to have taken part in the conception of CGI.[33]"

Gerstein, Josh (May 4, 2017). "The one weird court case linking Trump, Clinton, and a billionaire pedophile". Politico. Retrieved January 3, 2019.

[lapucelle]

79. The Clinton Foundation and The Clinton Global Initiative are two different things.

Epstein's lawyers said that Epstein took part in the conception of the Clinton Global Initiative (an annual event) therefore Epstein is a possible co-founder of the Clinton Foundation? Really?



The full paragraph from your out of context Wiki quote:

The Clinton Global Initiative (CGI) was founded in 2005 by Bill Clinton. Doug Band, counselor to Bill, was heavily involved in the formation.[14] Clinton has credited Band with being the originator of CGI and has noted that "Doug had the idea to do this."[32] Band left his paid position at CGI in 2010,[11] preferring to emphasize his Teneo business and family pursuits, but remains on the CGI advisory board.[12] The overlap between CGI and Teneo, of which Bill was a paid advisor, drew criticism.[11] Disgraced financier Jeffrey Epstein is also said, according to his lawyers, to have taken part in the conception of CGI.[33]

[mcar]

95. Well if Epstein's lawyer said it...

[lapucelle]

97. IKR...and then to leap to the conclusion the Epstein was a "co-founder" of the Clinton Foundation...

[mcar]

98. Lots of baseless speculation going on here

But it's about someone named Clinton so why not? I await the speculation that this all somehow is Hillary's fault.

[lapucelle]

100. Spouting irresponsible nonsense like "pathological privacy led HRC to set up the private server

to protect Bill from his entanglements" when it was actually installed as a cybersecurity measure on the recommendation and under the supervision of the Secret Service after the 9/11 attacks.

[mcar]

103. ...

[StarfishSaver]

138. SMH

[sheshe2]

150. Then it must be true!!!!

[mcar]

153. Right?

Let's believe the pedophile sex traffickers lawyer.

[ehrnst]

116. That's not what you said. That's not the Clinton Foundation.

Care to retract?

Some here seem to jump at the very opportunity to bash a Clinton with impunity, even to the point of spreading untruths.

[pnwmom]

122. He was a member of that Global initiative thing. The money didn't go directly to the Foundation.

People paid 10K (pocket change for them) to be a member, and being a member meant going to a few meetings, hobnobbing with other rich guys, and promising to fund some charitable effort directly.

[lapucelle]

140. Here's a list of speakers at the final CGI meeting.

https://www.clintonfoundation.org/clinton-global-initiative/meetings/annual-meetings/2016/speakers

Here are some of the commitments to action:

https://www.clintonfoundation.org/clinton-global-initiative/commitments

[pnwmom]

141. Yes, they were doing some good work! nt

[ehrnst]

115. Well, that's not a backhanded unfounded smear of Bill Clinton AT ALL.

Possibly... I imagine your sources are completely reliable.

[lapfog_1]

121. I said that despite 4 of the "girls" now women coming forward and naming

other men who may have raped them... nobody has named Bill Clinton.

That said, it's only 4 out of who knows how many have come forward.

Epstein was definitely involved with Clinton, providing the former President with many flights on his private jet. He also donated money to the Clinton foundation.

Does any of that say that Clinton engaged in sex with any of Epstein's underage victims? No.

My guess is that Clinton did not... but he should have chosen the billionaires to be friends with and to take favors from more carefully.

[sweetloukillbot]

10. Wasn't that tossed around here in the 2016 primary wars?

[Mach1miles]

13. This won't go well here.

Best to let it rest and let the courts sort it out.

[samnsara]

19. i know....i hate to see Bill being brought up again. Poor Hills.. she cant catch a break..

[Tech]

17. Can we focus on current people in power first? If there are dems at fault we will call

then on it.

[GoCubsGo]

18. Epstein donated millions to the Clinton Foundation.

It remains to be seen whether or not their relationship went beyond that. Epstein was chummy with LOTS of public figures, male and female. He he's a businessman and does a lot of his business on his private islands. A lot of people rode on his planes. There aren't really any other ways to get there if you don't own a private jet. And, a lot of his friends and associates have their own planes, so not riding on them doesn't absolve those whose names never showed up on the manifests (e.g., Donald J. Trump.)

Just remind your co-workers that Bill Clinton is not the co-defendant on rape charges against Epstein. Trump is.

[ehrnst]

117. Source for that donation? There are many "donations" attributed to the foundation that weren't

donations at all.

[pnwmom]

125. Do you have a non-rightwing link for that?

[ehrnst]

137. I don't know about you but I'm not holding my breath... (nt)

[EffieBlack]

25. You're doing a lot of baseless speculation with absolutely no evidence

[elfin]

30. Just inferences from real history. Otherwise, point taken. We shall see. eom

[LanternWaste]

40. Invalid inference due to fallacy of Relevance Through Presumption

[ehrnst]

108. Smears that came from someone's imagination, especially concerning HRC 'covering' for Bill

Not too subtle shiv there.

That's what it is when you can't back up anything you "Imagine."

[emulatorloo]

32. Well said n/t

[jberryhill]

34. Welcome to DU

Didn't you know that Pence was called back to the WH the other day, because Trump and Pence were both going to be arrested for involvement in Eptein's crimes, thus making Nancy Pelosi president?

I learned that right here on DU.

I'm just waiting for confirmation from Louise Mensch and Michael Avenatti.

[RobinA]

45. Wait, Wait

I thought Trump was brought down by Mueller!

[jberryhill]

60. No, Trump was brought down by Michael Avenatti

Didn't you notice?

[AlexSFCA]

101. even if there is evidence trump molested girls

he won’t lose any support. There is only ONE thing he can do to lose support - change his stance on immigration. Nothing else does it for deplorables. But what it would do is energize dem turnout in 2020.

[lapucelle]

54. The private server was set up in 2002 on the advice of the Secret Service

which had been given the mandate for executive branch cybersecurity following the 9/11 attacks.

So much for your theory concerning HRC's "pathology".

Have a donut.

[Celerity]

129. that is incorrect, the original server was set up in 2008 and it was in 2009 that Sec Clinton

had a new one configured so she could use it for her emails, as the first one (purchased in 2007, used from 2008 onward) was just for Bill (presidentclinton.com and wjcoffice.com).

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-31806907

Shortly before she was sworn in as secretary of state in 2009, Hillary Clinton set up an email server at her home in Chappaqua, New York. She then relied on this server, home to the email address [e-mail], for all her electronic correspondence - both work-related and personal - during her four years in office.

She also reportedly set up email addresses on the server for her long-time aide, Huma Abedin, and State Department Chief of Staff Cheryl Mills.

She did not use, or even activate, a state.gov email account, which would have been hosted on servers owned and managed by the US government.

Mrs Clinton's email system became a national story the first week of March 2015, when the New York Times ran a front-page article on the subject. The article said that the system "may have violated federal requirements" and was "alarming" to current and former government archive officials.

snip


All the Clintons’ servers: Hillary first used a Power Mac tower for e-mail
FBI memo details evolution of HRC's private e-mail from basement tower to managed service.

https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2016/09/fbi-clintons-first-e-mail-server-was-a-power-mac-tower/

Step 1: Power Mac

The Power Mac, originally purchased in 2007 by former President Clinton's aide Justin Cooper, had acted as the server for presidentclinton.com and wjcoffice.com. Cooper managed most of the technology support for Bill Clinton and took charge of setting up Hillary Clinton's new personal mail system on the Power Mac, which sat alongside a firewall and network switching hardware in the basement of the Clintons' home. Accounts were set up for Secretary Clinton and her staff by her husband's staff.

But the Power Mac was having difficulty handling the additional load created by Blackberry usage from Secretary Clinton and her staff, so a decision was made quickly to upgrade the server hardware. Secretary Clinton's deputy chief of staff at the State Department, Huma Abedin, connected Cooper with Brian Pagliano, who had worked in IT for the secretary's 2008 presidential campaign. Cooper inquired with Pagliano about getting some of the campaign's computer hardware as a replacement for the Power Mac, and Pagliano was in the process of selling the equipment off.

Step 2: Dude, you’re getting two Dells

It was kismet, and in March of 2009, Pagliano delivered two servers to Chappaqua—a Dell PowerEdge 2900 running Windows Server and Microsoft Exchange and a Dell PowerEdge 1950 running Blackberry Enterprise Server (BES). Cooper and Pagliano together acquired additional network and storage hardware. Initially, Pagliano said, he believed the servers were for President Clinton and not for the Secretary.

Pagliano acquired an SSL certificate for the mail server to provide added security for remote e-mail access at that time, and the whole configuration was set up in the Clintons' basement. The Power Mac was converted into a workstation for use by the Clinton household staff, and its contents were eventually backed up to an iMac.

snip

[lapucelle]

136. A domain account was set up for HRC after a replacement server was installed. N/T

[ehrnst]

110. It sounds like "probably" someone is "hoping" what they "inferred" is proven true.

Uber-rich, angry fantasy life some people have, expressed in passive agressive "I wonder..." terms.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

21. Epstein was probably friendly with a lot of important people,

since important people, including and probably especially politicians, tend to frequently hang out with very rich people. It's not likely that many of Epstein's famous acquaintances also participated in his abuse of underage girls, but a lot of people are going to be embarrassed that they even socialized with the guy at all.

[Judi Lynn]

26. Why ask Democrats for "dirt" on former President Clinton? Unexpected. n/t

[lapucelle]

58. Where did you hear that?

[Calculating]

61. Probably the same place Melissa B down below did

[lapucelle]

73. She didn't say that WJC "flew out to Epstein's 'private island' multiple times". You said that.

Where did you hear it? Are you aware that it was floated as a right-wing talking point in 2015?

Clinton’s ties to Epstein became an issue during the recent presidential race. Reince Priebus, then chairman of the Republican National Committee, was among Republicans who demanded a full accounting of the former president’s dealings with Epstein. “When you hang out with a guy who has a reputation like Jeffrey Epstein, multiple times, on private jets, on weekends, on trips, on places at least where it’s been reported not very good things happen, it would be good to know what our former president was doing, especially because it appears he’s going to be part of a campaign ticket on the other side of the aisle,” Priebus told Bloomberg in 2015.

snip==========================================

A Freedom of Information Act request for Secret Service records of visits Clinton may have made to Epstein’s Little St. James Island produced no such evidence.

https://www.politico.com/story/2017/05/04/jeffrey-epstein-trump-lawsuit-sex-trafficking-237983

[DeminPennswoods]

85. Forgot about Clinton still having a secret service security detail

That might make things a bit uncomfortable for the agents if they were being asked to ignore criminal behavior.

[lapucelle]

87. I don't think Secret Service would ignore criminal behavior. N/T

[DeminPennswoods]

143. I don't think so either

That's another reason to think it unlikely that Clinton was involved with underage girls.

[ehrnst]

111. Are you saying that among Bill Clintons "moral failings" might be the rape underage girls

that Epstein provided?

IDK, it seems some here to have waited a long time for a chance to shiv a Clinton here on DU, maybe not.

[solara]

41. Maybe Pence is a little bit scared

or maybe has a guilty conscience- could be why he refuses to be in a room alone with a woman without his "Mother" - (erm, I mean Karen Pence) with him and maybe why he rushed back to DC in a panic ( I am assuming the panic part..I just SO wanna see him go DOWN)

[Jose Garcia]

43. Let the chips fall where they may

[WhiteTara]

44. In all the years since he went to Africa w/Epstein

on his plane the question has been around; however, there has never been one accusation from any girl or woman over the years; but if it's on him, it's on him.

[50 Shades Of Blue]

48. There are pictures of Epstein's "girlfriend" Ghislaine Maxwell at Chelsea Clinton's wedding.

They appear to be legit. Not going to link any here but easily found online.

[MelissaB]

49. I hope Clinton isn't involved in this, but did he fly on that plane 26 times because the seats were

comfy?

Hoping for the best, but not expecting it here.

[lapucelle]

86. Let me put your troubled mind at ease.

A Freedom of Information Act request for Secret Service records of visits Clinton may have made to Epstein’s Little St. James Island produced no such evidence.

https://www.politico.com/story/2017/05/04/jeffrey-epstein-trump-lawsuit-sex-trafficking-237983

[MelissaB]

166. Thanks!

[ehrnst]

113. I assume you're going to delete post that now you have been shown it's a lie?

I assume your "sources" for that are impeccable...

But if you're "not expecting" to be proven wrong about those lies, then sources really don't matter, do they?

[MelissaB]

167. Oh, good grief!

[ehrnst]

168. So you're not going to delete a post that perpetuates a debunked smear?

Good to know that about you.

[MelissaB]

178. He's listed on the flight logs I think 19 times.

I haven't seen it debunked. I've seen one news article. Will I delete a post that is a discussion and hasn't been proven either way? No.

[lapucelle]

184. So are you still "not expecting the best"

now that you know about the Secret Service logs? What did you mean when you said

but did he fly on that plane 2⃫6⃫ 19 times because the seats were comfy?

Do you have a link for your "19 times" figure?

[MelissaB]

187. Flight logs:

https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/1507315-epstein-flight-manifests.html

[lapucelle]

188. Bill Clinton's name (along with "4 Secret Service") appears twice in those 73 pages of logs.

[AJT]

50. I think Epstein will be pardoned by 45 before any trial.

It is a federal case, a pardon is possible. I doubt much of anything will get out.
It's better for Epstein to take the pardon and be guilty than to go through a very public trial.

[Calculating]

64. Seems like that would be pretty bad for the Donald in the polls

Pardoning a child rapist? Idk how well that would go with his religious base.

[AJT]

66. Maybe, but if 45 is implicated in a trial the pardon would be better than the ugly

sick details of his encounters with young girls.

He'd make up some lame excuse for why he pardoned him, and his base would buy it.

[Calculating]

74. It's funny, the republicans generally want the trial to go through because of Bill Clinton

At least what I read over on their sites. They think Bill will get caught up in this and get taken down. They need to be careful what they wish for IMO.

[lapucelle]

90. "I heard that Bill Clinton flew out to Epstein's 'private island' multiple times"...

..."At least what I read over on their sites"

Did you "hear" that "Bill Clinton flew out to Epstein's 'private island' multiple times" on one of "their" right wing sites and then head over to DU to tell the tale?

https://upload.democraticunderground.com/100212255958#post61

By the way, the right wing theory you floated was debunked several years ago.

A Freedom of Information Act request for Secret Service records of visits Clinton may have made to Epstein’s Little St. James Island produced no such evidence.

https://www.politico.com/story/2017/05/04/jeffrey-epstein-trump-lawsuit-sex-trafficking-237983

[comradebillyboy]

67. His religious base worships Trump and Trump alone.

[BannonsLiver]

88. They won't mind.

That’s pretty obvious by now. There is no red line.

[LenaBaby61]

91. "Pardoning a child rapist? Idk how well that would go with his religious base."

Fatso's real hard core base doesn't CARE anything about him pardoning the other freak. They only care that a pardon would would probably get libtards angry, and drive them crazy

Secondly, I can see a possible scenario where the Liberal (Corporate) media focuses it's attention on Bill Clinton, and just lets Epstein and tRump fade away into the background. You know how that "liberal" 4th estate hates them some Bill Clinton. A friend who can stomach Morning HO said that they (Mika/Joe) bought up Clinton numerous times when talking about this whole affair. You know that tRump, if he can pardon the rapist, will start with the crooked Hillary chants and probably tell Faux Noose to trot out those women who accused Clinton of rape that tRump bought to his debate (Paula Jones, Kathleen Willey, Juanita Broaddrick etc.). Even Ken Star, who hated the Clinton's said that Juanita Broaddrick was not at all truthful IE: The Rape allegations against Clinton. As I recall, she testified that he didn't rape per while sworn under oath, then she changed her tune when off the witness stand and went right back to saying that Clinton raped her.

I'll just stay tuned.

[spanone]

51. I've seen it mentioned on CNN and M$NBC....

with out any follow up or proof

[saidsimplesimon]

52. Dirty laundry.

I'm over the mistakes of our Democratic past, as I perceive them. MoveOn

[Bettie]

53. What I generally ask

Here's a CNN video.

https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2019/07/08/jeffrey-epstein-political-connections-clinton-trump-nr-hill-sot-vpx.cnn

But, I'd say that if there was anything there beyond the usual politician schmoozing the rich dude, we'd likely have heard about it.

If, however, Bill Clinton is involved with young girls, he should face the consequences of that.

[panader0]

55. Per DUer Duppers--26 times.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=12254846

[lapucelle]

154. The cited "fact" is from a Fox News report

In September 2002, Epstein flew Bill Clinton, Kevin Spacey, and Chris Tucker to Africa in his private jet. According to flight records, Bill Clinton flew on Epstein's plane 26 times.[59]

Epstein's Wikipedia entry

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=12254846

The footnote cited in that post ([59]) goes today's Justice Department announcement about the arrest.

59. "Jeffrey Epstein Charged In Manhattan Federal Court With Sex Trafficking Of Minors". www.justice.gov. July 8, 2019. Retrieved July 8, 2019.

Here's the quote and the correct source for the claim:

According to flight records, Bill Clinton flew on Epstein's plane 26 times. He flew without Secret Sevice at least 5 times.[64]

64. Zimmerman, Malia (May 13, 2016). "Flight logs show Bill Clinton flew on sex offender's jet much more than previously known". Fox News. Archived from the original on October 9, 2016. Retrieved October 9, 2016.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeffrey_Epstein#cite_note-FoxnewsClintonEpstein-64

[panader0]

155. Here's my post on the subject: I said "a few times".

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=12252871

[lapucelle]

159. Here's the post that I responded to.

[panader0]

160. Duppers has since deleted that post after seeing the error

of his or her information. I was wrong to repeat it and should have
looked into it more. I voted for Bill Clinton. But I must admit to some
disappointment about his affair in the Oval Office with Monica.
And the quote: "That depends on what your definition of 'is' is".

[lapucelle]

161. Yes. He deleted it two minutes after it was revealed that it was a Fox News "fact".

How serendipitous.

[George II]

163. Bill Clinton said he flew on his plane four times, and never went to the island.

[lapucelle]

164. Yes, but Fox News said...

[lapucelle]

157. And now the poster seems to have just self-deleted the misattributed Fox News claim.

Here's a screenshot:

[Demsrule86]

173. Multiple times on 4 trips.

Why Deoocrats want to do the heavy lifting for the right is beyond me.

[MaryMagdaline]

56. I hope to God Bill Clinton isn't caught up in this

but if he is ... so be it. A lot of Hollywood guys thought they could make massive donations to charities and to the Democratic Party, and somehow, we lefties would jump to their defense if they were caught abusing people. No more. Abusers have to know now that it will come out, sooner or later. The only safe choice is not to abuse. Democrats have to stand up for the victims.

[ehrnst]

139. You sound so doubtful for one who claims to have "hope."

[pnwmom]

144. Of course he will be "caught up" in this -- so will Hillary. But that means nothing.

These are the same people who invented Pizzagate. They will always accuse the Clintons, no matter what.

But so far there have been no victims to publicly accuse Bill, and after all this time I would think someone would have come forward.

[lapucelle]

148. I'm sure you'll be relieved to know that WJC's office has issued a statement!

[maryellen99]

63. You all think BC rapes 13 year olds and lusts after his daughter like trump does? Nt

[uponit7771]

70. +1, no one would be shocked at red Don wrapped up in this crap

[Vinca]

72. They're reporting today that BC visited Epstein's island as well as flew in the plane.

I hope to hell he isn't involved in this, but if he is I hope he's charged. Same with all the rest of them. It's hard to imagine Trump getting off. No way he passed up Ivanka-aged girls.

[maryellen99]

75. Me too I think they are going to only charge Democrats for this and trump will skate away nt

[samnsara]

76. i know.. i feel the same way.. i hate to throw BC under the bus to get at...

...trump but if that what it takes Im ready to stand in support of Hills...shes got a hell of a lot to deal with and she never catches a break..

[lapucelle]

134. Who is reporting that? Do you have a link?

I didn't happen according to Secret Service logs.

A Freedom of Information Act request for Secret Service records of visits Clinton may have made to Epstein’s Little St. James Island produced no such evidence.

https://www.politico.com/story/2017/05/04/jeffrey-epstein-trump-lawsuit-sex-trafficking-237983

[Vinca]

169. It was on either MSNBC or CNN. In any case, Clinton put out a statement and denied it.

[lapucelle]

170. Either CNN or MSNBC was reporting that Bill Clinton visited Epstein's Island?

They're reporting today that BC visited Epstein's island as well as flew in the plane.

I was switching between coverage of those networks all day yesterday. I didn't hear that report. An advanced search of their sites shows nothing about reports that Bill Clinton visited Epstein's island.

I wonder why MSNBC or CNN would report such a thing when the Secret Service said it never happened.

Even Fox News was forced to admit it never happened back in October 2016 when they were trying to link Clinton to Epstein's island (as per one of the footnotes in Epstein's Wiki biography and a 2017 Politico story).

https://www.politico.com/story/2017/05/04/jeffrey-epstein-trump-lawsuit-sex-trafficking-237983

[Vinca]

171. It was before the Secret Service report was made public.

The point of my post is that unlike Republicans, if a Democrat happens to be involved in the Epstein case, we won't stand behind them. This isn't a hit job on the Clintons, even though you seem to be implying I'm after Bill Clinton.

[lapucelle]

172. The point about the Secret Service was made public in October 2016 after Fox's FOIA request

for the records was fulfilled and then reiterated in a Politico story in May 2017.

[Vinca]

174. That's nice. You better let MSNBC and CNN know. They aren't the only outlets who have reported

the Clinton/Epstein connection. I'm glad Bill Clinton put out a statement yesterday and I hope there's nothing uncovered in the searches of Epstein's properties that implicates him in any way. Now . . . can we let this go or are we going to beat a dead horse all day???

[lapucelle]

177. And that brings me back to my original question...do you have a link to any of the many outlets

that reported yesterday that Bill Clinton had visited Epstein's island?

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

78. Don't know how Bill Clinton is connected

Last edited Mon Jul 8, 2019, 05:50 PM - Edit history (1)

But I do know this much, I've never heard of Bill Clinton looking at an underaged girl and saying he'll be dating her in a few years.

I've never heard Bill Clinton brag about walking into a room where teenage girls were changing their clothes.

[sheshe2]

128. Or pictured enjoying a lap dance with his young daughter.

If you look at the wider picture, the man two seats away looks shocked.

[TalenaGor]

81. Prison for any and all who participated, protected, financed etc,

My hope is that none of our people were involved but if they were they need to go down with that Titanic.....

I personally will not behave like the Republicans by acting like it's okay for certain people to engage in this kind of activity.....IDGAF

[ehrnst]

96. Your concern is noted.

[centrarchus]

102. Allan Dersowitiz (sp), Clinton, Prince Harry(?) and Trump

These guys were on the plane or the yacht. Trump referenced the yacht parties in his speech to the boy scouts. OMG...

[cwydro]

107. Prince Andrew, not Prince Harry.

[maryellen99]

114. Prince Andrew not Harry nt

[lapucelle]

147. Welcome to DU!

Have a donut.



(I think you're mixing up Prince Harry and Prince Andrew. Was the Secret Service on the yacht too? Where did you hear about the yacht?)

[captain queeg]

131. Let's not get ahead of ourselves. Wait for Hannity and Carlson to weigh in.

Of course it would not surprise me if those scumbags have some more direct, insider knowledge. It will be interesting to see their opinions. Of course I can’t stand listening to either one of them so will have to wait till someone posts their take on it here.

[riverwalker]

135. One victim, Virgina

says she would see Clinton at the house but she never had sex with him, and never saw anyone else have sex with him. So who knows.

[lapucelle]

145. According to Secret Service records, Clinton was never there.

A Freedom of Information Act request for Secret Service records of visits Clinton may have made to Epstein’s Little St. James Island produced no such evidence.

https://www.politico.com/story/2017/05/04/jeffrey-epstein-trump-lawsuit-sex-trafficking-237983

[Demsrule86]

175. Link

[democrank]

146. My concern is for real justice for the victims.

[saidsimplesimon]

151. Just a few words

Please self delete. There is nothing "factual" to report. I'll point you toward that voice within, slow down, breath, think before we speak.

[trueblue2007]

156. I ECHO YOUR WORDS. THIS IS A BAD THREAD. Just a few words Please self delete.

[saidsimplesimon]

158. trueblue, deleting my remarks, easy

I can't delete the thread. So....I think, we both wasted valuable time

[snowybirdie]

180. As of last night

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2019/jul/8/bill-clinton-issues-jeffrey-epstein-statement/

[delisen]

181. Kenneth Starr ws one attorney for Epstein who arranged light sentence

and reduced charges in Florida. (Ken Starr, prosecutor of Clinton was afterwards disgraced by his own role in Baylor U cover-up of sex scandal)

Starr, Acosta, Bill Barr-all have ties to the big Republican law firm of Kirkland, Ellis.

Barr is also tied to Epstein through the Dalton School in Manhattan where Barr's father was headmaster and had given Epstein, age 20, a job teaching math.

No one seems to really know how Epstein became so rich-he has told different stories and investigative reporting seem to raise many questions about his business ethics. Some reports indicate that he and his assistants set up encounters for the young girls with the rich and powerful and then debriefed the girls.

This would suggest the possibility of blackmail and/or being able to call upon the rich and powerful for help if he got arrested. Although he had made contributions to Democrats before his first arrest, he turned to the most high-profile Republican law firm for his defense.

The published statements of at least one of the victims reports more than one sexual encounter with Donald Trump.

I think the republican connections are going to be much more revelatory than the Democratic Party connections. After he was sentenced he seems to have ended most political funding and turned to academic funding, although in 2018 he tried to donate $10000 to the DCCC. I was quickly returned to him.