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H2O Man

(73,559 posts)
Sat Jul 14, 2018, 07:36 PM Jul 2018

Indictments Today [View all]

Yesterday's indictments of 12 Russian military intelligence officers was outstanding. It's fair to say that Trump and others from his campaign and transition teams are “captives” of the Russian indictments. There has been some outstanding analysis, both in the media and here on this forum. I'd like to add a few thoughts to the discussion.

The first thing is that people should not get their hopes up that Trump et al will be charged with treason. In its common usage, “treason” is the most accurate description of what they knowingly did. In that sense – and that sense alone – people are correct in calling it treason. But in the legal sense, as defined by constitutional law, there is zero chance that they will be charged with treason.

It is apparent, however, that Malcolm Nance was correct many months ago, when he said the group will most likely be charged under the Racketeer Influenced Corrupt Organizations Act (also known as the RICO statute). We've seen that Mr. Mueller has been charging groups of Russians twice now, which suggests that in the larger domestic case, he is likely to take the same route. And, as Mr. Nance has recently stated, this allows for the listing of Donald Trump as an unindicted co-conspirator. Since he has been absolutely correct on virtually everything since releasing his 2016 book on the hacking of America, I trust his insight and judgment.

Next, a good prosecutor builds a conspiracy case, as everyone knows, by chipping away, both from the fringes and from the weakest links. Then, he/she uses a systematic process to close in on the top targets. Thus, for example, they targeted General Flynn, a weak link. Then, they indicted a group of Russians for internet activities such as their program on Facebook. Next, they indicted the 12 Russian intelligence officers.

Was it a coincidence that these indictments became public yesterday? Malcolm Nance has noted that in intelligence operations, coincidence take planning and hard work. Mr. Mueller is prosecuting cases from counter-intelligence investigations. The indictments against the 12 Russians had been diled as sealed indictments some time ago, and were opened days before Trump meets with Putin. This is a national security issue, that shows how seriously Mr. Mueller considers the upcoming meeting.

Finally, the fact that Mr. Rosenstein had informed Trump that these indictments were coming, apparently the day before Trump left for the NATO business, is also important. It goes a long way in explaining why Trump's meltdown – when he accused Germany of being a captive of Russia – was so ugly. The old fellow is feeling the pressure of the Mueller investigation closing in on him. Likewise, it explains why the republicans questioning Peter Strzok were so unhinged: their attacks upon him target Mr. Mueller by way of Mr. Rosenstein.

These republicans are planning to try to impeach Mr. Rosenstein, to allow Trump cover to fire him. In their current plan, they do not want Mr. Rosenstein to actually face trial, since as he has said, this would allow him access to their e-mail accounts, etc. (Thus, in a congressional hearing, republicans asked if it were true he had threatened those advocating his impeachment.)

Things look bad for Trump and his co-conspirators. Very bad. So we can anticipate that they will attempt more foolish though destructive actions in upcoming weeks. Count on it. And count on Mr. Mueller to counter their desperate attempts to avoid the legal consequences of their criminal, treasonous behaviors.

Peace,
H2O Man

85 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Indictments Today [View all] H2O Man Jul 2018 OP
just... handmade34 Jul 2018 #1
Thank you. H2O Man Jul 2018 #14
In agreement that Ethel was probably innocent. Xolodno Jul 2018 #81
Well said, as always, my dear H20 Man. CaliforniaPeggy Jul 2018 #2
Well, thank you! H2O Man Jul 2018 #15
I've said for many years Hayduke Bomgarte Jul 2018 #3
I agree! H2O Man Jul 2018 #17
Thank you for clarifying the indictments coeur_de_lion Jul 2018 #4
Thanks. H2O Man Jul 2018 #18
K & R malaise Jul 2018 #5
Thank you. H2O Man Jul 2018 #19
+1000 Pachamama Jul 2018 #54
That Washington Post Report on malaise Jul 2018 #56
There will be more smoking guns....I am sure of it.... Pachamama Jul 2018 #57
Treason - Laurence Tribe may disagree with you RandomAccess Jul 2018 #6
Wow! That piece by Tom Coleman needs to have an OP of its own! nt scarletwoman Jul 2018 #8
It actually does RandomAccess Jul 2018 #9
Oh, thank you for the link! I obviously missed that post! scarletwoman Jul 2018 #10
You're welcome RandomAccess Jul 2018 #11
Respectfully disagree. H2O Man Jul 2018 #21
Wait. There are more of us Scarsdale Jul 2018 #63
I agree. H2O Man Jul 2018 #66
Actually, there IS a war going on. cilla4progress Jul 2018 #27
I believe so as well... handmade34 Jul 2018 #36
Yes -- someone, can't remember who -- RandomAccess Jul 2018 #38
Sure. You are correct. H2O Man Jul 2018 #40
I appreciate your insights FakeNoose Jul 2018 #7
They're always worth the read. calimary Jul 2018 #20
Thanks, calimary H2O Man Jul 2018 #23
Thank you! H2O Man Jul 2018 #22
K&R blue-wave Jul 2018 #12
Well said. H2O Man Jul 2018 #24
Thanks for the compliment blue-wave Jul 2018 #29
Well, sure! H2O Man Jul 2018 #77
"It is time to prove that we are a nation of laws" handmade34 Jul 2018 #37
K & R. warmfeet Jul 2018 #13
Thanks, warmfeet! H2O Man Jul 2018 #25
Good post SHRED Jul 2018 #16
Thank you. H2O Man Jul 2018 #26
Just downloaded it cilla4progress Jul 2018 #30
H2O Man, cilla4progress Jul 2018 #28
I agree. H2O Man Jul 2018 #41
Your threads cilla4progress Jul 2018 #42
Oh, thank you! H2O Man Jul 2018 #44
I can't pretend for a moment to be astute enough to understand the intricacies of... Guilded Lilly Jul 2018 #31
Right. Exactly right. H2O Man Jul 2018 #43
Thank you, actually. This is such a horrific struggle, every day. Guilded Lilly Jul 2018 #64
It is horrific. H2O Man Jul 2018 #78
It might be more certain to charge conspiracy, but I wouldn't count out treason Sophia4 Jul 2018 #32
Great points! H2O Man Jul 2018 #45
Could be. But they will have to decide whether to limit or expand the charges. Sophia4 Jul 2018 #47
I respectfully disagree. KentuckyWoman Jul 2018 #33
I'm somewhere in the middle. Pacifist Patriot Jul 2018 #35
I'll start by saying H2O Man Jul 2018 #46
Multiply by 10 on the crimes...divide by 10 on the consequences Awsi Dooger Jul 2018 #79
You seem to be overlooking the fact that republican primary voters put Trump in position jaysunb Jul 2018 #80
If treason comes it will be in a second wave Takket Jul 2018 #34
Outstanding reply! H2O Man Jul 2018 #49
Agreed. Sophia4 Jul 2018 #58
This is so hard to watch. Seeing our country being destroyed from within. spanone Jul 2018 #39
Absolutely. H2O Man Jul 2018 #50
Trump's decision to ignore the 12 Russians indicted... kentuck Jul 2018 #48
It's disgraceful, kentuck. H2O Man Jul 2018 #51
And all Republicans share the disgrace. kentuck Jul 2018 #55
They are traitors to this nation. H2O Man Jul 2018 #73
Lower than whale shit.. kentuck Jul 2018 #75
Yes, but remember, there still has been *0* indictments! Oneironaut Jul 2018 #52
Exactly! H2O Man Jul 2018 #53
One question DonaldsRump Jul 2018 #59
This is my question too. We're in treacherous uncharted waters! PearliePoo2 Jul 2018 #61
Great questions H2O Man Jul 2018 #70
Thanks for your response! PearliePoo2 Jul 2018 #84
Here: H2O Man Jul 2018 #85
As usual an educated well thought out piece by one of DU's best. sellitman Jul 2018 #60
Well, thank you! H2O Man Jul 2018 #68
I'm encouraged by reading your extremely well-written and thought out post! Thank you. PearliePoo2 Jul 2018 #62
Thanks! H2O Man Jul 2018 #69
I enjoyed every word kpete Jul 2018 #65
Thanks, kpete! H2O Man Jul 2018 #71
Thank you for your perspective. PatrickforO Jul 2018 #67
Thanks PatrickforO! H2O Man Jul 2018 #72
Thanks, H2O Man! orangecrush Jul 2018 #74
Thanks, orangecrush! H2O Man Jul 2018 #76
Great analysis as always! Blue_Roses Jul 2018 #82
Thanks! H2O Man Jul 2018 #83
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