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15. I keep looking for a legitimate proposal - one that isn't rumor or speculation

Sun Dec 9, 2012, 12:05 PM

Dec 2012

. . . it's easy to agree with all you've said -- one thing missing; the actual WH proposal that includes ANY of the objectionable issues you've raised.

This is just tilting at windmills. It's a curious and dubious platform for the criticisms you've made toward the party. Strange stuff. No more credible than any of the other reports about WH proposals which aren't part of what's been publicly offered by the administration. Is it too much to ask that we stick to debating actual proposals which have been finalized and made public? This strawman stuff can go anywhere. You've taken the rumors and speculation and compounded all of it into a neat little package to rail against. It's just not a credible basis for arguing the future of the myriad of issues underlying the budget talks.

Madhound: "once again we are looking at cutting more and more of our social safety net"

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We the people have already lost. [View all] MadHound Dec 2012 OP

See Lincoln the Movie. Compromise is how the USA was founded and has worked since graham4anything Dec 2012 #1

Please don't insult my intelligence by telling me to see a movie in order to learn anything, MadHound Dec 2012 #4

Noone was talking to you. I was responding to anyone reading in. graham4anything Dec 2012 #6

Well excuuuuuuuse me for daring to think that your post, a reply to mine, is actually meant for me MadHound Dec 2012 #11

there is no way to answer a post except to hit respond to post graham4anything Dec 2012 #13

New Rule? When NOT responding to OP preface response TO EVERYONE BUT THE OP: gateley Dec 2012 #91

Are we to understand your comment here reeds2012 Dec 2012 #72

He's been trying to shill this film for over a week. Just another "my team right or wrong" Egalitarian Thug Dec 2012 #90

The absolute 100% or don't agree is working real well for us- WHEN THE REPUBS DO IT!!! graham4anything Dec 2012 #96

Wow, someone is twitchy Katashi_itto Dec 2012 #159

Did you even read the OP before responding? AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2012 #58

behind closed doors? maindawg Dec 2012 #81

I don't think you understand how America has worked 1776-present graham4anything Dec 2012 #87

A New Constitution would be fun AldoLeopold Dec 2012 #107

From a strictly political science view, MadHound Dec 2012 #112

the tea party is a great example of both absoulutism and anarchy as one graham4anything Dec 2012 #113

No, it isn't, MadHound Dec 2012 #117

You are using #5 of 5 of the meanings. I am using #1,2,3,4 graham4anything Dec 2012 #119

Two questions, MadHound Dec 2012 #121

Both graham4anything Dec 2012 #125

First of all, please don't make assumptions about what I am doing, OK, thanks. MadHound Dec 2012 #130

Looks like you were talking to Madhound to me. Hissyspit Dec 2012 #154

there are only two sides. Never a third shall be,unless the repubs leave the ballpark like the Whigs graham4anything Dec 2012 #157

Right. If not responding to the OP and not responding to anyone else in the thread, Dark n Stormy Knight Dec 2012 #158

you got it Mel Dec 2012 #32

Thank you tavalon Dec 2012 #37

oh no Mel Dec 2012 #41

Nope y'all are NOT alone...... socialist_n_TN Dec 2012 #124

I totally agree with you, Tavalon and keep wondering, "Has nobody explained this to Obama yet?" We People Dec 2012 #77

I feel sure that they know about it.......... socialist_n_TN Dec 2012 #126

See the movie jpak Dec 2012 #76

Why? Hissyspit Dec 2012 #169

Granted, it is a film. janx Dec 2012 #174

The Civil War was a result of failed attempts at foul compromise. Bluenorthwest Dec 2012 #7

Puts on HAZMAT suit AldoLeopold Dec 2012 #102

Compromise is how this country works according to you and a movie and I don't disagree. Cleita Dec 2012 #25

+1 villager Dec 2012 #47

What Cleita said. nt Nay Dec 2012 #84

Cleita, I would go so far as to use a different "C" word. dotymed Dec 2012 #168

Yes, collusion too. Very good to remind me. Thanks. Cleita Dec 2012 #170

You attitude is a good example of why we are where we are today. We been settling for 10% until rhett o rick Dec 2012 #26

How's compromise been working for you for the last 20 years? Doctor_J Dec 2012 #86

LBJ is the greatest and worked well to get all those social acts/civil rights/voting rights acts graham4anything Dec 2012 #120

Yeah, the greatest, except for all that killing of innocents in Vietnam, MadHound Dec 2012 #123

JFK authorized Bobby to wiretap Dr. Martin Luther King. and renewed it. graham4anything Dec 2012 #128

And what does that have to do with LBJ escalating a war under false premises, MadHound Dec 2012 #131

Thomas Jefferson said all were equal while keeping slaves graham4anything Dec 2012 #133

Well, now that I've seen what a poor grasp you have of both history and reality, MadHound Dec 2012 #134

LBJ staked his presidency on the War On Poverty and the VRA Doctor_J Dec 2012 #132

And that's what we want. We want the REPUBLICANS to compromise for a change. . sabrina 1 Dec 2012 #106

no, actually, war is how the US was founded & maintained, the very opposite of compromise. HiPointDem Dec 2012 #156

In the movie, Lincoln was going for permanent emancipation. merrily Dec 2012 #165

If there is a deep spending cut, we may be looking at another major recession. Selatius Dec 2012 #2

Well, I'm John2 Dec 2012 #68

+1000 heaven05 Dec 2012 #78

Post removed Post removed Dec 2012 #82

No, we really ProSense Dec 2012 #3

Well Said! sheshe2 Dec 2012 #20

I keep hoping to see Democrats stand up for Democratic principles... Octafish Dec 2012 #5

+1 LeftInTX Dec 2012 #12

"instead ... we get ... Trickle Down and Voodoo Reaganomics." What's worse, we are now in the AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2012 #62

We (Democrats) need to take an initial position that is so extreme that any movement bluethruandthru Dec 2012 #8

+1 abelenkpe Dec 2012 #9

+1 Start with 'Confiscate The Assets of the Rich' leftstreet Dec 2012 #17

Nationalize some industries that are vital for our defense. Like the defense industry and oil. nm rhett o rick Dec 2012 #28

...add banks, healthcare, energy leftstreet Dec 2012 #34

Yup! nm rhett o rick Dec 2012 #42

That would work for me. AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2012 #64

Exactly. rudycantfail Dec 2012 #30

Excellent! yewnix Dec 2012 #173

Welcome to DU. Enjoy your short stay. yourout Dec 2012 #176

More anti-Democratic Party shit stirring jpak Dec 2012 #10

The Democratic Party is doing a fine job of that on its own leftstreet Dec 2012 #14

And what arguments are you bringing to the table? Real Democrats realize that shit stirring is good. rhett o rick Dec 2012 #33

Obama won - get over it jpak Dec 2012 #38

I get it. Pres Obama won so you can go back to watching American Idol. nm rhett o rick Dec 2012 #39

Obama hate fail jpak Dec 2012 #50

Intelligence fail. nm rhett o rick Dec 2012 #175

I keep looking for a legitimate proposal - one that isn't rumor or speculation bigtree Dec 2012 #15

I am really flippin' tired of the negativity from this poster. babylonsister Dec 2012 #21

It's easier than doing the work, babylonsister. Talk is cheap. Cynicism is cool. freshwest Dec 2012 #151

but, but??!!! heaven05 Dec 2012 #31

I don't feel 'burned' by our side bigtree Dec 2012 #43

a lot heaven05 Dec 2012 #53

as for 'precedent' show me where this President has made cuts to the social safety net bigtree Dec 2012 #59

longer view heaven05 Dec 2012 #74

Didn't he appoint Alan Simpson and Erskine Bowles to a committee???????? socialist_n_TN Dec 2012 #129

You don't own a Time Machine as the OP does. Ikonoklast Dec 2012 #57

That was excellent, MadHound......... plethoro Dec 2012 #16

+1000 heaven05 Dec 2012 #24

President Obama won't give up anything that hurts a lot of people... Comrade_McKenzie Dec 2012 #18

And by then... Oilwellian Dec 2012 #118

Can we get ProSense Dec 2012 #19

I heaven05 Dec 2012 #22

We need to be expanding Medicare to cover all our citizens JEB Dec 2012 #23

It's Also A Political Trap ProfessorGAC Dec 2012 #27

I agree with you 100%. We, the people, are being sold down the river Cleita Dec 2012 #29

It's the American way since Trickie Dick and the false 'Gas Shortage ' orpupilofnature57 Dec 2012 #36

Until The People Civilly Disobey In Mass Numbers Nothing Will Change cantbeserious Dec 2012 #35

I am no longer sanguine that will work either... plethoro Dec 2012 #40

No guarantees, but........ socialist_n_TN Dec 2012 #51

Okay, I agree with that. It has to be a message so plethoro Dec 2012 #60

Well that's the question isn't it........ socialist_n_TN Dec 2012 #66

Great reply. We have met the enemy and it is plethoro Dec 2012 #70

Thanx and as I said above....... socialist_n_TN Dec 2012 #73

well heaven05 Dec 2012 #75

I agree John2 Dec 2012 #85

i think emphasis riverbendviewgal Dec 2012 #44

Fortunately, Obama will veto any cuts to the safey net.....won't he? Tierra_y_Libertad Dec 2012 #45

I'll bet serious money on or. Egalitarian Thug Dec 2012 #92

We... 99Forever Dec 2012 #46

One thing to remember. NO agreement........ socialist_n_TN Dec 2012 #48

+1 Egalitarian Thug Dec 2012 #94

The Corporate State controls the framing SHRED Dec 2012 #49

+1 rudycantfail Dec 2012 #55

I'll give it it's own thread...thanks SHRED Dec 2012 #63

Great post, MH, but I have a suggestion about raising taxes. Zorra Dec 2012 #52

+1 n/t Oilwellian Dec 2012 #127

I had no illusion. The only thing I felt fairly certain about was the Supreme Court. Everything still_one Dec 2012 #54

With respect to the Supreme Court, what are you fairly certain about? AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2012 #67

better than the federalist society judges. also judges who support right to still_one Dec 2012 #115

She's better than the RW Federalist Society judges? Does she want to be? Or be the same? AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2012 #147

We don't need new ideas or solutions, we only need history books. JaneyVee Dec 2012 #56

It was only and always about cutting our earned benefits! Slight of hand. Rocky888 Dec 2012 #61

And that became apparent the minute the anti-SS gang were appointed to the sabrina 1 Dec 2012 #138

With the GLARING monster bill that we give the military, nothing else needs saying. Gregorian Dec 2012 #65

Great post. nt raccoon Dec 2012 #98

All that military stuff ends up in a landfill eventually, just like all the junk we buy from China. Flatulo Dec 2012 #114

Only If We Give Up, Have We Lost Demeter Dec 2012 #69

Best post on here since the election in my opinion. go west young man Dec 2012 #71

Some eerie parallels between the immediate appearance of the "Fiscal Cliff" and the "Patriot Act" We People Dec 2012 #93

They are not naive. woo me with science Dec 2012 #103

Excellent post. The good part of all this is that the people are no longer as naive sabrina 1 Dec 2012 #116

I have reached sulphurdunn Dec 2012 #79

MadHound, you're right.... ReRe Dec 2012 #80

With so many realistic and optimistic DUers your talents may be wasted here. great white snark Dec 2012 #83

Yes, I see the femrap Dec 2012 #88

DURec! bvar22 Dec 2012 #89

Amazing isn't it? And we have yet to learn what they will give up in sabrina 1 Dec 2012 #104

Oh god, don't mention raising taxes on the non-rich here jmowreader Dec 2012 #95

The defense spending & the Bush tax cuts to the ultra-rich are the culprits. pacalo Dec 2012 #97

I was kind of looking forward to the fiscal cliff AldoLeopold Dec 2012 #101

The business world's cushy association with Reagan's presidency put a lot of people out of work. pacalo Dec 2012 #105

The Military "Jobs" Program is money down the toilet. bvar22 Dec 2012 #108

K&R woo me with science Dec 2012 #99

Jill, is that you? You lost! Get over it! Tarheel_Dem Dec 2012 #100

Yes. LWolf Dec 2012 #109

We the People have very little representation.... Junkdrawer Dec 2012 #110

Yep... K & R !!! WillyT Dec 2012 #111

But, but... we just reelected Obama!! Iggy Dec 2012 #122

Right! His triangulation and appeasement for four years Doctor_J Dec 2012 #136

We can pressure Congress, they have a future to think of. And we should do so sabrina 1 Dec 2012 #139

You're Joking, Right?? Iggy Dec 2012 #145

You are right. But I think we were still recovering from the Bush years and people sabrina 1 Dec 2012 #148

I Hope You're Right Iggy Dec 2012 #161

I Can't Wait..... Iggy Dec 2012 #144

I think ProSense Dec 2012 #146

Who knew... Bonobo Dec 2012 #135

Lots of people knew. Doctor_J Dec 2012 #137

You bet we have already lost. woo me with science Dec 2012 #140

Then people should have fought back harder against Ralph Nader & his lies. graham4anything Dec 2012 #141

And we have always been at war with Eastasia. woo me with science Dec 2012 #142

Now some want to fight China. Instead of embrace new customers and citizens of the world graham4anything Dec 2012 #143

Well said! Too bad that no one is on the side of the people any more. emsimon33 Dec 2012 #149

most amazing trick I never saw decayincl Dec 2012 #150

Tax cuts for the rich won't happen to the real rich zentrum Dec 2012 #152

It seems to me you are assuming things not yet proven. Dyedinthewoolliberal Dec 2012 #153

+100 HiPointDem Dec 2012 #155

both parties are negotiating TOGETHER against US.... tomp Dec 2012 #160

Agree completely, but make it the last *fifty* years that that lesson has been learned. eomer Dec 2012 #162

what is your source for this latest "they are selling us out" panic? arely staircase Dec 2012 #163

Hear, hear! k&r n/t Laelth Dec 2012 #164

Obama on "entititlements" and deficit reduction 2009-2010; Conyers on Obama, 2011 merrily Dec 2012 #166

MadHound has it right. olegramps Dec 2012 #167

+1 Whatever crumbs are ostentatiously handed to the 99 percent after this debacle, woo me with science Dec 2012 #171

If Repubs want to save money on Medicare just end the no negotiation kiranon Dec 2012 #172

This message was self-deleted by its author Fedaykin Dec 2012 #177