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H2O Man

(73,537 posts)
Sat Nov 4, 2017, 12:24 PM Nov 2017

Twisting in the Wind [View all]

“I think we ought to let him hang there. Let him twist slowly, slowly in the wind.”
John Ehrlichman; 1972.


Since joining in 2003, DU has been my favorite internet site. I've enjoyed “meeting” many individuals who have become good friends ….some of whom are still part of the DU community, and others who are no longer here. I like the the discussions about important topics where one can learn new things, including other points of view, regardless of if I agree dully with them. There are some people who always make me think. One of these people is “grantcart,” and his response to my last OP reminded me of a story that Rubin once told me.

An isolated tribe of people came upon an airplane that had been left in the wilderness. The first man who climbed into it was amazed by the comfortable seats within the plane. In time, another man figured out how to start its engine, and began using it as a convenient car. But because they were satisfied with comfort and convenience, the tribe never understood that the plane could fly.

I thought of this, because frequently, “grantcart's” posts take discussions to a higher level. They soar above the more common communications found on OP/threads. In the current post, he noted – in detail – some of the history of another large nation, a century ago. Because, as historian Arthur Schlesinger, Jr. documented, history tends to go in cycles.

Back in the “good old days” of DU:GD during the Plame scandal, a significant number of community members posted high-quality essays and posts that drew upon their personal knowledge of history, political science, sociology, psychology, and other areas of interest. These helped the larger community “connect the dots,” and more fully understand the national and international events that were spinning out of control under George W. Bush, Dick Cheney, and assorted neoconservatives in their administration.

This got me thinking about some current events that I'd like to focus on now. The general topic is how the Mueller Team is approaching the on-going investigation, based in part on their understanding of the personality structures of three of the criminals – Flynn, Manafort, and Trump. Let's take a brief view.

Michael Flynn is a strange case, but certainly not unique. People of my generation are reminded of General Edwin Walker. (Robert Mueller, for example, is fully aware of this.) Both were products of military schools, both had rigid, authoritarian personalities, and that combination allowed both to function within the structure of the military. Both would be promoted to high levels, which eventually led to their personality deficiencies being exposed. In their post-military careers, each became involved in right-wing politics.

Paul Manafort provides an example of serious anti-social personality disorder. He belongs to a group of corrupt people, who only have an allegiance to each other, primarily because they work together on various criminal enterprises. People with personality characteristics such as Manafort are often drawn to working with a psychopath.

Trump is a psychopath. More, he belies the mistaken belief that psychopaths are “evil geniuses.”

Now, the current manual for diagnosing mental illness in the United States makes psychopaths a part of ASPD. This is relatively new. It is because insurance coverage was far more available to pay for treatment of ASPD, which can be successful in certain circumstances, than psychopathy. Hence, the change. But, to be sure, investigators and prosecutors understand the distinction, and attempt to use it to their advantage.

Team Mueller is aware that both Flynn and Manafort attempt to live by a code that is distinct from that of the larger society. Flynn views Mr. Mueller as an “enemy of the state,” and thus hesitates to cooperate with him. Manafort views Mr. Mueller as “the law,” and likewise hesitates to cooperate. Neither wants to be a “rat.” But, in both cases, they have sons who are identified as being in legal jeopardy, and have thus the human impulse to protect their offspring. And that is exactly where Team Mueller will apply maximum pressure to turn them.

Trump's son, daughter, and son-in-law are also at risk of being indicted. One can easily identify a number of questions that Mr. Mueller will ask Donald, Jr., For example, what exactly did Junior mean a few years back, when he said that “Russian money is flowing in” to the family business? We know his father dictated the lie about his “adoption” meeting, which on the surface could be mistaken for a dad trying to protect his son. But that isn't the way Trump rolls.

When push comes to shove, Trump is the most cowardly of men. He lacks the trait that would allow him to even consider accepting responsibility for his actions, even if doing so would potentially protect his spawn. For he has no conscience, no meaningful concept of “family,” beyond as an extension of himself. And he will sacrifice any such extension – be it family or friend – to save himself.

When investigators and prosecutors approach a case with such dynamics, they identify such personality traits. They focus on those weak links in the chain, both within the group and within the individuals involved. This includes the weak spots within the individuals who are considered “strong” by the group.. Those weak spots are known as “keys.” And we are seeing Mr. Mueller playing those keys like a master plays a piano.

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Twisting in the Wind [View all] H2O Man Nov 2017 OP
Thought provoking. I appreciate it. I look for your threads and comments. MLAA Nov 2017 #1
Thank you. H2O Man Nov 2017 #2
Fingers Crossed Those 'Keys' Me. Nov 2017 #3
They will. H2O Man Nov 2017 #4
Already Better Tha Fitzmas Me. Nov 2017 #5
Right. H2O Man Nov 2017 #16
I Think The Case/Cheney Hinged On Fitz Turning Libby Me. Nov 2017 #17
Yeah, but Libby was benign compared to Cheney. Libby Alice11111 Nov 2017 #26
I can not think of anyone Scarsdale Nov 2017 #48
Absolutely. While he demands loyalty, sycophant style, Alice11111 Nov 2017 #59
So good to see your name on this site kgnu_fan Nov 2017 #6
Thank you! H2O Man Nov 2017 #27
I wouldn't go so far as saying Brazile is a psychopath, KitSileya Nov 2017 #47
Vindictive, and is being given credence by other vindictive people. (nt) ehrnst Nov 2017 #50
Post removed Post removed Nov 2017 #60
The intercept? KitSileya Nov 2017 #61
Nice op LiberalLovinLug Nov 2017 #7
Thank you. H2O Man Nov 2017 #28
very good read bluestarone Nov 2017 #8
Thanks! H2O Man Nov 2017 #29
Nicely done. cachukis Nov 2017 #9
Thank you! H2O Man Nov 2017 #31
I've always thought of Donald Trump in that vain. Mr. Evil Nov 2017 #10
Trump definitely acted that way when his brother died csziggy Nov 2017 #21
Thanx for the info. Mr. Evil Nov 2017 #24
This is huge. H2O Man Nov 2017 #35
Right. H2O Man Nov 2017 #34
Trump... Splat! Mr. Evil Nov 2017 #41
Really Interesting Post peggysue2 Nov 2017 #11
Thanks, peggysue2! H2O Man Nov 2017 #37
MOST interesting, H2O Man. calimary Nov 2017 #12
Thank you! H2O Man Nov 2017 #38
Hey, I've often talked about sparring class and what it taught me about calimary Nov 2017 #58
Thanks for a real post SCantiGOP Nov 2017 #13
Thank you! H2O Man Nov 2017 #39
Very thought provoking and hopeful. Thanks as always. Hekate Nov 2017 #14
Thanks, Hekate! H2O Man Nov 2017 #40
Recommended. panader0 Nov 2017 #15
Thanks! H2O Man Nov 2017 #52
Well thought out and expressed. GoneOffShore Nov 2017 #18
Thank you! H2O Man Nov 2017 #53
Best piece I've read today! pandr32 Nov 2017 #19
Thanks, pandr32! H2O Man Nov 2017 #54
Then it was easier to finger the enemy, the fly in the ointment was Rove and the perps were fewer in shraby Nov 2017 #20
Spawn. Trump's kids. erronis Nov 2017 #22
Well done! MuseRider Nov 2017 #23
Old school post H2O Man. denbot Nov 2017 #25
K&R Solly Mack Nov 2017 #30
As always, we can count on you for a thought provoking post. PatrickforO Nov 2017 #32
Yes - I remember the Old Days of DU jpak Nov 2017 #33
Those weak spots are known as keys. And we are seeing Mr. Mueller playing those keys like a master malaise Nov 2017 #36
When you write, I think. democrank Nov 2017 #42
Agree with your comments Sensitive soul Nov 2017 #43
Welcome to Democratic Underground, soul. I look forward to seeing you here. NBachers Nov 2017 #45
As Mueller keeps chopping away at Trump's trunk, Trump will gyrate further & further out of balance, NBachers Nov 2017 #44
Good one. pwb Nov 2017 #46
K&R orangecrush Nov 2017 #49
Well said SHRED Nov 2017 #51
H2O Man! So interesting! Thanks for posting your thoughts. Madam45for2923 Nov 2017 #55
Thanks for the analysis. Nitram Nov 2017 #56
Thanks for the post that keeps the little grey cells active. Interesting Enoki33 Nov 2017 #57
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